PLC SCHOOL!

[balerjoe 0]

Here is a link to a PLC school. I'm wanting to dig a little deeper and get better. Check this link out and tell me if it's worth my time. I accidently post this in the AB thread as well. Sorry! Thanks Joe http://www.plctechnician.com/plc_cont.html

[Mickey 71]

Kind of pricey, look at these two before you buy. http://www.thelearningpit.com/ http://www.koldwater.com/

[balerjoe 0]

The only difference I see is that the one I quote seems to be accredited. A person could use these credits in futhering his education.

[larry818 0]

Check into the accrediting body. At least here in california, there are many. The cal state system accredits them selves, as does the UC system, with different accrediting bodies. Many private colleges claim to be accredited, but not by bodies recoginsed by "real" schools. Somehow, ITT got accredited by the body that does the cal state system, so their units are good.

[Guest]

be careful ... there’s “accredited” ... and then there’s “accredited” ... my point: if you’re planning to apply credits from this course at another specific institution, then I recommend that you check with the second institution BEFORE you take this ... in some cases, “accredited” just won’t fly ... I suggest that you take some time and tell us what you already know ... and what you want to learn next ... and what benefit you expect to derive from that new-found knowledge (better job? ... promotion?) ... and give us a list of what learning resources you have available ... a spare PLC? ... some software? ... etc. ... maybe we can come up with some better ways to meet your needs ... PS ... I just noticed that larry818 beat me to the “beware the accredited course” topic ... so that’s at least two warnings along the same lines ...

[balerjoe 0]

Alright here a little history on me. I work in a dairy plant. In this plant we use Allen Bradley Rslogix500 & 5000. We use Carlson HMI. Everything from devicenet to controlnet. I have read some of the books downloadable here on this site. I have rslogix 5000 & Emulator on my pc. No hmi platform on here yet. I've been playing w/it created a traffic light simulation. I 'm trying now to understand Sequencers. Also trying to pick up PID's well. I got it to work but I still don't understand them well. I can write logic ok but I want to be really good. Here at the plant we have one person who know controls but is not real willing to share. I work w/projects here at the plant. Being able to write my own code would be nice to save a few dollars on smaller projects. Being capable at controls gives me the ability to help w/reducing shrink which is king in this buisness. Understanding how to improve the process increase productivity. These are things that at the end of the day will put more money in my back pocket. I will be working on building new plants in the future. Being on the same level as a intergrator & programmer will be nice. Any help will be much appreciated. Thanks Joe

[Guest]

Greetings Joe, you started out by asking: “Should I take this course?” ... first let’s paraphrase some of the personal objectives that you’ve posted and take a look at them: and all the way through the rest of the “modules” which we skipped over, we see much the same thing ... it looks like this course promises to teach you a lot about how to “Define” and “List” and “Describe” and “Explain” and “Name” stuff related to PLCs ... on the other hand, I’m not seeing a lot (anything?) here which is likely to help you meet the goals which you listed ... now the course MIGHT actually be a humdinger ... and it MIGHT be well worth the money ... but ... personally, I’d need the assurance of getting a lot more "meat and potatoes" type material before spending my $1,450 ... so what else is there? ... if I were you I’d consider this “self-help” plan ... pick out a process or a piece of machinery at your plant ... maybe it’s an old one that could use a tune-up ... maybe it’s a brand new one that’s working PERFECTLY ... it doesn’t matter ... just pick one ... now pretend that the project of building that particular machine is in its very first stages of development ... you’re the engineer ... pretend that you’re going to design it from the ground up ... type up the specifications (and pay close attention to your spelling and grammar - they DO count in this business) ... give an overview of what the process is supposed to do ... list EVERYTHING that goes into the machine (raw milk, electricity, cold water, hot water, operator’s control settings, steam, etc., etc., etc.) ... big hint: leave something out and you’ll $PAY$ for it later ... then list EVERYTHING that goes out of the machine (processed milk, heat, drain water, condensed steam, etc., etc., etc.) ... same big hint: leave something out and you’ll $PAY$ for it later ... at this stage of development, the machinery is just one big box on a piece of paper ... a lot of arrows point into the box (each input gets a separate arrow) ... and a lot of arrows point out of the box (each output gets a separate arrow) ... now take each arrow and work on it individually ... “raw milk” goes in ... define “raw milk” ... how much “raw milk”? ... any special temperature range? ... “hot water” goes in ... how hot does the “hot water” need to be? (specify a range) ... how much “hot water”? ... getting the picture? ... we haven’t even THOUGHT ABOUT the PLC end of things yet ... but at least we’re getting started ... now look at the “tail end” of all of those “input” arrows ... where does the “raw milk” come from? ... where does the “hot water” come from? ... etc. ... etc. ... if the answer is “from somebody else - and not from me” then you need to WORRY about the “tail end” of all of those input arrows ... because if YOU (as the engineer of the new machine) don’t carefully specify EXACTLY every single detail about each one of those inputs that you need, then “somebody else” is going to goof up the works - and your machine won’t work right ... for example: you even have to specify what pipe size and type of fitting the “hot water” comes through ... now look at the “pointy end” of all of those “output” arrows ... where does the “condensed steam” go to? ... where does the “drain water” go to? ... etc. ... etc. ... if the answer is “to somebody else - and not to me” then you need to WORRY about the “pointy end” of all of those output arrows ... because if YOU (as the engineer of the new machine) don’t carefully specify EXACTLY every single detail about each one of those outputs that your machine is producing, then “somebody else” is going to goof up the works - and your machine won’t work right ... for example: put out twice as much drain water as you expected and see who they blame when the plant floor gets flooded ... and yes, you even have to specify what pipe size and type of fitting the “drain water” goes out through ... now let’s skip ahead to another step ... sizing the machinery ... so you need to pump 25 gallons per minute of “milk” through this thing ... what size pump will that take? ... what horsepower motor will the pump require? ... what will the electrical load be? ... what size wire will that load take? ... what size contactor will you need to service the motor? ... or will you use a VFD to control the pump speed? ... etc. ... etc. ... etc. ... steam heat? ... electrical heaters? ... control valves? ... solenoid or proportional? ... proportional will probably need a pneumatic air supply ... and an I/P transducer ... 4 to 20 mA input? ... now let’s skip ahead to another step ... listing the I/O ... NOW we’re finally getting around to the PLC end of things ... by now you should have a good idea (hopefully a PERFECT idea) of the input things that the PLC will be required to monitor ... and of the output things that the PLC will be required to control ... make the list ... check it twice ... and be sure to list the voltages, current requirements, etc. for each and every “innie” and each and every “outtie” ... again that big hint: leave something out and you’ll $PAY$ for it later ... now that the I/O list is prepared, you’re finally ready to start thinking about which PLC platform you want to use ... PLC-5? ... SLC-500? ... ControlLogix? ... and warning! ... do NOT leave the customer out of this phase of the proceedings ... just suppose that he has a plant FULL of PLC-5 systems ... he’s got spare parts to fit these already on his shelf ... his technicians are already trained on the PLC-5 and they’re familiar with troubleshooting those systems ... their laptop computers are already loaded with RSLogix5 software ... the sun is shining ... the birds are singing ... life is lovely ... now you come in - fat, dumb, and happy - and deliver a new piece of machinery with a ControlLogix processor to control it ... oops! ... Customer: “You mean that now I’ll need to buy more spare parts?” ... “Now I’ll have to pay to have my technicians retrained?” ... “Now I’ll need new software?” ... “Heck, my old laptops won’t handle anything newer than Windows 98. So now I’ll need to replace the laptops too?” ... anyway ... now that you’ve got the PLC platform chosen, you’re ready to specify the PLC hardware ... how many input modules? ... what voltage? ... how many output modules? ... what voltage? ... how much current? ... analog inputs? ... analog outputs? ... what size chassis? ... how big a power supply? ... how much memory for the processor? ... does this thing need to be networked? ... or is it a “stand alone” system? ... what type of network? ... etc. ... etc. ... etc. ... and what size enclosure will we need to hold all of this gear? ... and now ... finally ... the fun stuff ... now it’s time to start thinking about how to write the ladder logic program to make this thing work ... anyway ... if I were you, I’d think about going through this entire project ... step-by-brutal-step ... each day I’d post my progress (ALL of it - right or wrong) on the forum ... here you have a LOT of professional people available who will gladly help you advance - FOR FREE ... all that you need to do is put forth the effort ... and ask for help and constructive criticism as you go along ... finally ... I suggest that you work through at least one or two exercises like the one that I’ve just outlined ... you’re lucky (I prefer to say “blessed”) to already have some software and other resources available ... so this approach should cost you little or nothing - except for your time (and possibly your sanity) ... so pay your dues ... then (and only then) should you start shopping around for PLC training courses ... by that time you’ll have a much better feel for what you’re looking for ... and for what you need ... anyway ... that’s my advice ... I hope this helps ... Edited 22 May 2007 by Ron Beaufort

[balerjoe 0]

Do I get a degree from this project? J/K I'll see what I can do.

[Mickey 71]

No its better then that, if you take Ron's advice you are going to learn something.

[robh 12]

Very well put Ron. Thats how I learned alot of what I know. I don't think that I could have explained it that well though. Thanks

[benbrad 0]

Well put Ron, this is sort of how I learnt too, although I did get a bit of training. If your company uses a particular type of plc as a favoured choice try sweet talking their sales rep. into giving you some free training. Our company uses Omron on 80% of the plant, we said to the rep that we would change the rest to Omron if we had a bit more in house knowledge of Omron plcs. Next thing I know I'm off to Omron to do both their basic and advanced programming courses. This didn't make me a master programmer or anything remotely close but it did give me more insight into plcs and their modules, code structure, how to analise problems and how to break them down into managable chunks. I returned to work and was immediately given a project to do. I now write more code for the company than our main contractor. I've designed a couple of new machines, cleaned up loads of bugs in existing processes and in doing so have learnt masses. Backwards engineering, as part of bug fixing, is very rewarding as you get to see how the "pros" tackle the problem. You can learn a lot of tricks this way.

[Mickey 71]

Check this out: http://cgi.ebay.com/PLC-Automation-Series-...1QQcmdZViewItem