is Pay-Pal OK?

[Guest]

just a quick question - sort of a poll ... I am about to be dragged (kicking and screaming) into the realm of buying things on e-bay ... I hate to admit how naive I am on the subject, but I’ve got a question about setting up a Pay-Pal account ... I’m thinking about linking it to my personal credit card account (instead of to a checking account) ... personally I haven’t heard anything “bad” about using Pay-Pal - but then I’ve lived a sheltered life ... so ... anybody got any horror stories to share? ... or is it basically a case of “just go ahead and do it - everybody else does” ... I’ll appreciate any advice you nice folks might be willing to share ...

[Ken Moore 23]

I am a part time ebay buyer and seller. I have about 100 total transactions. I have never had any issues with paypal. I bought my wife's current vehicle through ebay, only the deposit was via paypal, rest was in cash, in person. If you accept credit cards as a seller there is a fee. I don't think there are any fees for buyers. I think it's one of those go ahead and do it things. BTW, I did have one problem with a seller that never sent the item I paid for. I filed a complaint through paypal, it took about 45 days to resolve, but I got my money back.

[Jay Anthony 118]

When you sign up, you are going to be asked to "verify" your account which means that you submit a second source for your "backup funds" (in most cases, your checking account.) The aggravating thing is that the account will now default to the "backup funds" and if you are not careful, it will take the payment from your checking account rather than your credit card. You are always given the option (read the fine print) to select "more funding options" (hyperlink in fine print) so that you can select the payment to come from your credit card. After all that is said, I like Paypal very much.

[BobLfoot 302]

Had an account for years, but only used it a few times. No problems I can speak of. For what it is and where it is It is remarkably robust and safe IMHO.

[Crossbow 296]

Never had a problem. And as previously mentioned, there is no fee to the buyer, it all comes out of the seller portion.

[Bob O 8]

If it is PLC or lab related, what type of items are you looking for? Edited 28 Aug 2008 by Bob O

[Nathan 7]

I used to use Paypal a lot. Haven't in a while. Have never had, or heard stories of significant problems. With the exception of social engineering (users being retarded), you should be fine. I would tend to use credit cards over debit cards for protection reasons.

[Guest]

thanks guys, that's exactly what I had hoped to hear ... and especially the "gotcha" type stuff from Jay ... thanks again to all of you ... note to Bob_O ... I'll give you a call soon and discuss it ... no time now to type ...

[pandersen 0]

I've used paypal for years and personally I don't have it linked directly to my checking account. Just a comfort thing for me. On the other hand, there is an interesting fact about what PayPal does with your money while it sits in your account. Whatever sits in your account is invested by PayPal into various places, so they make money off of your money. Just remember PayPal is NOT a bank, it is a business and wants to make money. I've heard stories where people make large sales, then PayPal locks their account for some reason, suspicious activity usually. The money sits there earning interest for PayPal while the person is forced to wait for their money while dealing with bureaucratic bull****.

[Guest]

thanks pandersen ... that's the first I've heard of that particular angle ... not that I doubt it at all ... but stuff like that is EXACTLY the reason that I want to link it to a credit card - and not to a bank account ... in fact, I'm in the process of setting up a separate credit card account for the Pay-Pal people for JUST the type of reasons that you mentioned ... I’m just paranoid about that sort of thing ... sort of related ... several months ago I got to noticing how all of our accounts (mine and my wife's) were tied together by the bank ... in other words, one card could access and/or transfer money from any account to any another ... we NEVER used those features - so I pulled the plug on the setup ... now I've got ONE small account that I can access with a card at the ATM ... for anything else I drive to the bank ... I've heard of crooks getting their hands on your "magic card" number and then cleaning out everything - even the credit-line limit of your “bounce-proof” checking account ... I don't have a lot - but I want it to stay where I put it ... two weeks after I got things separated, my wife’s car got broken into (in broad open daylight) parked right in front of the county library ... she was only in there for less than ten minutes to drop off a book ... but she’d left her purse on the seat - with the doors locked ... all we had to do was report the ONE card that she had been carrying - not five or six like she had crammed in her purse a few weeks earlier ... and NO checkbook - we had decided against carrying that too ... (she NEVER used it except to mail checks from home anyway) ... sort of related ... my wife used to work for a bank ... when she had nothing better to do, she'd pull up our accounts - just for fun ... she called me up in a panic one day and asked if I'd been to the Foot Locker and rung up about $400 worth of shoe sales on the credit card ... heck no ... it wasn't me, sweetheart ... she called bank security immediately - and they "hot carded" the account ... an hour later, they got an alert at Circuit City - where some dude was trying to charge several hundred bucks worth of stereo equipment ... cop cars surrounded the joint - blue lights flashing - the works ... story: the guy worked at the post office and had been stealing cards for SEVERAL years ... he’d feel a new card in an envelop - and just lift it ... the trick was that he’d only use each card for one or two days - and that’s why he never got caught ... by the time someone reported that the card was being misused, he’d already ditched that card - and lifted another one ... until he messed with Wanda Faye ... last I heard, he was doing twenty years (minimum) in the big house - on a federal “messing with the mail” rap ... thanks again for the tip ... Edited 29 Aug 2008 by Ron Beaufort

[tomalbright 0]

I set up Paypal with a card for that reason myself. However, due to getting laid off with 30K in card and other debt, I cancelled all my cards. Now, I use the account with my checking, and have had zero problems in 4 years. A card would be better, but you will be fine.

[tbode 0]

Go to this site and download the podcast, then make your own decisions. I use Paypal a lot but with a security dongle for login. http://www.grc.com/SecurityNow.htm Episode 119 PayPal and DoubleClick Leo and I dissect the "Links" on PayPal's site with an eye toward reverse engineering the reason for many of them routing PayPal's users through servers owned by DoubleClick. We carefully explain the nature of the significant privacy concerns raised by this practice.

[Guest]

I am NOT happy with PayPal ... too upset to type now ... tired of jumping through one hoop after another ...

[ssommers 20]

Mind me asking... what happened? I've had an unverified account with them since... forever... and haven't had any problems with PayPal directly. <Knock on wood> Of course, I keep the credit card that I use for PayPal totally separate from the card I use on a regular basis so I'd know immediately if there's something funky going on. I keep it unverified because nobody... repeat NOBODY... is going to get their hands on my bank account info. I'm hoping for you that it's just a minor misunderstanding in how to set up an account without giving away the candy store...

[Guest]

hi susan ... biggest gripe: if they had just TOLD me up front what was going to be involved, I'd have come up with something (ANYTHING) else to get this stuff ordered ... but no ... it's "do this and you'll be ok" ... not ok ... now "do this and you'll be ok" ... not ok ... now "do this and you'll be ok" ... and so on and on ... and to get these directions I'm forced to spend endless amounts of time (total of hours) listening to one commercial after another about how "great" PayPal is - and how important my call is to them ... if they'd just give me "dead air" to listen to, then at least I could get something else done while I'm waiting ... but no ... I've got to be told over and over how much fun I'm having with PayPal ... on the good side: EVERY ONE of their phone people were EXTREMELY polite ... it seemed that they really wanted to be helpful ... unfortunately the "system" wouldn't allow that to happen ... gotta go ... Edited 12 Sep 2008 by Ron Beaufort

[Mike Dyble 0]

Dont know if you have them in the states, but in the UK you can get a pre-pay credit card (if thats not twisted words!). You go to the post office and pay cash to 'top it up' then use it like a normal credit card with a limit which is your top up. They were originaly intended for people with 'credit problems' but people have caught on to using them for internet purchases. Basically you prepay the amount you are going to need plus the handling charge. Ideal for small internet purchases where you dont know anything about the set up at the other end. OK so you pay a handling charge, but on a small (£100 or less) purchase its around £3 and thats cheap for the peace of mind. If the sharks get hold of it all they get is a few pounds or even less, and there is no link to any other account, so its worthless.

[ssommers 20]

Ah... now I see your predicament... I think I've bought less than $300 of stuff using PayPal and never tried to buy more that $50 at a time, so I've never raised any flags. I do know that they have some kind of limit on how much you can buy/send as an unverified account. It used to be a $2500 lifetime cap, but they may have raised that in the last 5 yrs. Re: PayPal's service line... I hate listening to DirecTV's tech service phone line "ads" too. What ever happened to just plain muzak with the occasional "All our service reps are busy, but your call is important to us. The current average wait time is 20 minutes. You're number 55,432,989 in line." ? Since you're buying off of eBay, talk to the seller & see if they'll take a check or money order for the amount you owe instead of PayPal. Some will (if properly motivated). Some won't since they get a bit more payment protection by going thru PayPal and you get protected against fraudulant sellers who don't actually ship the wares you bought. I guess it's a matter of trust... but there isn't a lot of trust available these days given the way society is going. Good luck! Edited 10 Sep 2008 by ssommers

[Guest]

the biggest problem is NOT the limits ... it's being TOLD (repeatedly) that there are "no limits" ... it's having to experiment (over and over and over) to see how much you can run up at a time ... and keep wondering: maybe I'm just clicking the wrong thing ... let's try this way ... nope ... let's try this way ... nope ... let's try this way ... nope ... let's try this way ... nope ... ok ... let's call customer support and listen to PayPal commercials for a while ... it's being told that if you "verify" that there will be "no limits" ... ah, but there ARE limits ... because now you have to use your checking account to fund the transaction - and if you try to use the credit card it STILL has a limit ... and the main thing is that I've spent three days now piddling around with this ... had I been TOLD up front what was going to happen, I'd have ZERO complaints ... I'd have just found another way to get this done ... but I keep getting "welcome to PayPal" emails with pictures of butterflies and flowers telling me what a great time I'm going to have using PayPal ... it's the same feeling that you get when you wait an hour in line - just to finally get to the front and find out (you guessed it) you're in the WRONG line ... this is the one that's been killing me: frustrating? ... oh, yeah ... Edited 11 Sep 2008 by Ron Beaufort

[BobLfoot 302]

Makes me glad I am not doing any big money transfers with Pay Pal.

[ssommers 20]

OK, I've seen that message before... It's an eBay thing - not PayPal - where the seller decides they don't want to take credit cards because they get hit with an extra transaction fee on top of the auction fee. Usually the seller highlights that in the auction posting so people don't bid on something where they can't use their favorite payment method. I agree, the whole thing is frustrating. And the confusing payment methods disclaimer at the bottom of the auctions is the #1 reason I don't buy a lot thru eBay. I think eBay is WAY more frustrating than any other web service I've used.

[Guest]

nope ... not in this case at least ... I called the seller and he said: "that's not coming from my end" ... I called PayPal and they confirmed that it's my "lack of history" and "credit card funding" that's hanging it up ... (again - at least in this case ... your mileage may vary) ... now I've gone to the bank and made a deposit to my "use for online purchases" checking account to cover all of the stuff that I'm buying ... this is the one that's linked to PayPal ... once I know that the funds are "available" (tomorrow morning) I'll complete the PayPal payments - playing by their rules - and funding the transaction from the checking account ... that's the rub ... I'd have GLADLY done it this way Monday morning - if they had just told me up front that that was the only way to get this done ... I'm NOT trying to "beat the rules" or even "bend the rules" ... I just want to know what the rules ARE so that I can get my stuff on order ... I shouldn't have to "try this" and "try that" to find out what I'm allowed - and NOT allowed to do ... ESPECIALLY when "JR" at customer support says that I can "just change the funding to your credit card for each transaction" ... that works - but NOT for "unlimited" amounts ... funding with a credit card STILL has "limits" ... that's the part that isn't being made clear ... Edited 11 Sep 2008 by Ron Beaufort

[Guest]

from BobLfoot: now if somebody at PayPal had suggested that plan of attack to me a week ago, this whole episode would probably have been a breeze ... the frustrating thing is that I kept being told that once “verified” I would have no “sending limits” - and - that I COULD change the funding to use my credit card ... the part that bugs me is that I was never told that the credit card method would STILL have limits - even after I had been “verified” ... in other words, “no limits” doesn’t really mean “no limits” ... it means (I think) “no limits using the funds in your checking account” ... but ... you’ve STILL got limits when the credit card enters the picture ... and please don’t anybody waste any time explaining the reason for that policy to me ... I’ve got sense enough to KNOW why ... now then ... why doesn’t PayPal - in print and in telephone conversations - just explain the “rules” and be done with it? ... gotta go ... thanks for the opportunity to “vent” ...

[pandersen 0]

(You should remove your phone number from your post up there) Sorry to hear your trouble. I'm in the same situation as ssomers where I use PayPal for small transactions, never raised any flags.

[Guest]

I know I sound like I'm harping away at the same thing - but I KNEW before I got started that what I wanted to do was going to raise flags ... my complaint is that PayPal kept telling me that the flags wouldn't matter ... but they DO ... I talked to one of the sellers that I'm buying parts from - he's been doing this stuff for years ... according to him, some/most/all of the limitations "drop off" after you've been dealing ok for a "reasonable period of time" ... almost makes me want to keep banging my head against the wall - just to see how long it takes before it eventually stops hurting ... Edited 12 Sep 2008 by Ron Beaufort

[kevinj46 0]

In concept, I like paypal. Easy to use, quick and convenient for the buyer, and as a seller, gets the deal closed quickly. I have bought and sold maybe 100x on ebay and paypal. Since PP is the biggest gorilla, more people have it than any other place, so it helps sales. In reality, I stopped using it until I get things sorted out. I am looking at Google Checkout as an alternate for my online sales. Not decided yet. I used PP a long time without a bank linked. I would move money in, then unlink the accounts. No problems. About a year ago, PP rejected transactions because I didn't have a bank/credit account linked. I have $300 in the account, and could not complete a $12 transaction. PP changed their rules, the accounts must be linked. After maybe 25 phone calls through the frustrating voice mail, and a dozen emails (after finally finding the 'contact us' link that is thoroughly hidden), I keep getting form letter responses in 'how' to lift limits by adding a credit card. I have never gotten a real person to talk to, or reply to emails, to deal with 'why' have they changed. Take a look at www.nopaypal or www.paypalsucks. Granted, those are the very dissatisfied customers, but when I went back and looking into the terms of agreement (that we all read of course) what they are protesting is true. -you have agreed that PP can take money from your cc/bank account if your PP account runs low. That seems reasonable. -you have also agreed that PP can take money form your accounts for basically any reasons. -If you are deemed a scammer, or there is a dispute, PP can take money from your accounts to resolve the complaint, whether you are in the right or wrong, and before it is resolved. PP has already made it right with the person who complained, what they are doing is recovering their loss from your account. -If you have had DEALINGS with someone who is a scammer, or has a dispute, but not enough money to cover it, PP can take money from YOUR accounts to cover PP's exposure. So, if you bought a camera from someone and paid and are happy, but the same company cheats 100 other people, PP can take money from your accounts without your approval or knowledge. This one I thought was 'black helicopters' paranoia until I actually read all the way through the appropriate sections and verified it. -If there is a dispute, you agree that PP is the final arbitrator. In case of dispute, I agree that PP has the last word........So, if you have a dispute with your wife, you agree to both present your case, then your wife makes the final decision on the dispute. (Now, that may be reality but that is another discussion! ) I see a small conflict of interests here..... Now, in reality, PP response to all of the above is that 'we would never do that, it is only for extreme cases'. That to me is like giving all power to the paternalistic dictator government then being assured, 'trust us, we would never abuse the power'. Sort of like giving all your private info, and permission, to the nigerian scammers, with the 'trust me' promise. I assume you would not do that with some nigerian entity, why do it with PP? So, overall, PP has a very great place in the economy, just really beware. Here is what I am doing: -Use PP only when absolutely necessary -Investigating Google Checkout. May have the same issues, jsut not sure yet. -Create a prepay credit card account with say $200 or $100, linked to the PP. (NOT a regular credit card. PP could still withdraw up to your line of credit, or over, and that doesn't help.) I will ONLY use this card for PP. Be careful that credit card does not link to your other cards or bank, in case of overlimit. Most don't, as by definition a prepaid account is simply a fixed pot of money, but make sure it doesn't get automatically recharged from your main accounts. I had a hard time finding a prepay card without the $5/month charges. Ended up at USBank, and created a real, working business account there with checking, credit card, and the prepaid card. They use 'VisaBuxx'. -Create a dummy bank account as someone above has noted -Keep the absolute minimum in the accounts linked to PP -Make your voice heard to PP and complain. I don't know how, and it hasn't worked for me, but if enough start to gripe it can't hurt. Kcj