JamesT

Kinetix 3 firmware

18 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

Hi,

Can anyone advise on how to upgrade the firmware on Kinetix 3 drives (2071-AP8 Series A)? There is a firmware update option in Ultraware, but when I try that it says something like f/w version does not support upgrade. Is it actually possible to upgrade them at all? You can download new versions from the AB website, which suggests it must be possible. They currently have v2.00, and latest version is v2.23.

I know these are old drives, but they still work so might as well get some use out of them.

Thanks, James.

Edited by JamesT
correct model number

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Since there are only two versions for the A, I assume you're going from the 2.0 to 2.23? Have you verified which firmware is currently in the drive? Have you downloaded the firmware to your laptop from the AB website? 

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Yes, they are all running version 2.00, confirmed on the display and through Ultraware. Trying to go to v2.23. It's downloaded and the .hex file extracted. It's at the point I try to upload it that it says it can't be upgraded. See the screenshot...

firmware.thumb.png.fee07a2ac3d71b1133827

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Maybe, rather than trying to upgrade via Ultraware, try upgrading through the object in the project.

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Sorry, but which project are you referring to? If you mean a Connected Components Workbench project I've tried that as well, but can't get the drive to talk to it at all. CCW connects with a 1203-usb and the manual says to set the drive node address to 248, but the drive will only allow values up to 247! As a result (I assume) the drive doesn't show up in RSLinx (even though the 1203 recognises it and the green light is blinking). I was hoping that might be fixed in the firmware update. Ultraware is using an rs232 connection and connects fine.

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Sorry,  I was speaking of RSLogix or Studio 5000 project.  I have no experience with CCW.  Only other solution, I can think of is that the drive is fighting the upgrade because the CCW project is at v2.00.  You might have to first change the project to v2.23 and download to the controller, then attempt to upgrade the firmware of the drive.

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pcmccartney1 may be onto something here. When you create a project in CCW, you choose the FW rev for each device you add, unless you're discovering it. Is there a Micro-800 controller in this system that's talking to the Kinetix drive? If so, you will likely have to change the FW rev in the CCW I/O tree properties before downloading the new FW.

With regard to the 1203-USB, you won't see the drive, per-se, in RSLinx the way you usually do when using EtherNet or other networks. You will only see the 1203, and will be working ok or will have a big red X over it. If both the TX & RX lights are blinking on the 1203, and it shows up in Linx without an error, it's working. That means the reason you're not communication with the drive is the drive's comms are not configured correctly for the 1203. 

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Posted (edited)

Further to Guru's point, in RSLogix or Studio 5000, when adding the drive to the IO Tree, you have to make a selection regarding the "match" of the drive to the project.  It could be the Electronic Keying be set to either Compatible Module or Exact Match or Disable Keying.  You'll need to read the manuals to determine which it best for your arrangement.  This applies to IO modules, comms modules and drive (probably others as well).  Exact match is the hardest and would lead to the need to update the program and download before being allowed to upgrade the drive.  I tend to use Compatible Module as it simply checks that the device is the correct type.  I never use Disabled Keying, it could lead to someone replaceing a drive or IO modules with something that has nothing to do with the configured module the program is expecting.

I'm assuming that CCW has something similar if not the same.

Edited by pcmccartney1

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Thank you both for the suggestions. I've tried RSLogix but no joy, still can't get the drive to show up in RSLinx so RSLogix can't talk to it.

Quote

With regard to the 1203-USB, you won't see the drive, per-se, in RSLinx the way you usually do when using EtherNet or other networks. You will only see the 1203, and will be working ok or will have a big red X over it. If both the TX & RX lights are blinking on the 1203, and it shows up in Linx without an error, it's working.

I don't see the 1203 in RSLinx at all, which is probably the reason I can't get anywhere with RSLogix or CCW. The 1203 seems happy, if I set the mode to RTU Master and the node address to match the driver (just using the default of 1) the comms light blinks green constantly and the tx & rx blink occasionally when RSLinx browses. If I change the node address at either the drive or 1203, and not at the other end, they stop talking and I get a red flashing comms light. Then changing the other end to match again it goes back to green flashing, so I'm fairly sure they genuinely are talking to each other ok. The driver diagnostics in RSLinx look ok too, equal number of packets sent and received, no timeouts or bad packets. The only thing I can think of that's an issue is the manual does say I should set the drive node address to 248 but that's not possible - the max value is 247. There is no other controller in use, the setup is just Kinetix 3 <-> 1203-USB <-> PC.

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The 1203 should be configured as an RS232 driver, so you'll have to manually set up the correct comm port on your laptop, and you should NEVER use the auto-configure function. I've attached the user manual; go to chapter 3 for setup instructions. On page 3-3, the setting in step 8 have never failed for me. Once you have done this correctly, you should see a 1203-USB icon appear in RSLinx.

22comm-um004_-en-p.pdf

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That manual's for an ethernet adapter. I assume you meant drives-um001_-en-p.pdf

If so, that's exactly the setup I've got on the PC end.RSLinx.thumb.png.61da53a2bee6331e0be4982

 

I may now have destroyed the 1203-usb though. The documentation doesn't say what mode the 1203 should be in for the Kinetix 3, I previously found that only RTU Master appeared to work (flashing green diamond), but I decided to try the other options again in case I got a better result in another mode. Having tried a couple of different modes, latterly RTU Passthrough, the 1203 seems to have given up. When it powers up I get a flashing red diamond for a few seconds, then a solid green. It no longer responds on the serial terminal. I wouldn't have thought selecting the wrong protocol could cause physical damage, but it looks like it's dead now. An expensive mistake, unless anyone has any suggestions on how to recover the 1203? Maybe it was already on its way out, and that's why it wasn't letting me connect in the first place.

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Sorry for attaching the wrong doc. I have too many of these things on my laptop but you clearly found the correct manual and page.

I think the solid green on the top-center diamond means the 1203 has power and is transmitting or had transmitted data. Green flashing means on, but no data transferred. Either way, green is good.  I've never seen a 1203 go bad from changing the settings. If you've pooched the settings and it's decided to stop cooperating, try this:

  • unplug it
  • delete the driver from RSLinx and shut RSLinx completely down. You may have to use RSLinx Classic Launch Control Panel
  • go to your laptop Device Manager, Ports & Comms and make sure the device is gone
  • then re-create the driver in Linx and start over

When the 1203 is connected to and communicating with the drive, it should look like the picture at the top of page 3-5. The "workstation" is your laptop. The "AB/DPI" is your 1203/drive; it doesn't show up as an actual drive the way it would with an RSLinx EtherNet connection. Once you have that you should be able to get online with the drive with CCW, so long as you have a Kinetix drive installed in CCW with V2.0. From there, you should be able to flash up to the higher FW. "Should". 

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On 02/06/2020 at 10:06 PM, ElectronGuru said:

I've never seen a 1203 go bad from changing the settings. If you've pooched the settings and it's decided to stop cooperating, try this:

It didn't ought to be possible to break it so easily, but it certainly got itself into a bad state. It would not do anything any more, different PC / drive made no difference. I even hooked it up to 5v without a drive and it was just the same - flashing red till I tried to talk to it over the usb virtual com port and then it went solid green - but it clearly wasn't talking to the drive then. As it was still capable of blinking LEDs in a sensible manner, and I had been changing the config when it went bad, I took an educated guess that maybe the config on the 1203 itself was corrupt rather than a hardware failure. I ended up taking it apart and erasing the eeprom that stores the config. After that it restarted just fine with a default config, behaves normally, and presents the on-device config menu when I connect directly with a serial terminal.

Quote

When the 1203 is connected to and communicating with the drive, it should look like the picture at the top of page 3-5. The "workstation" is your laptop. The "AB/DPI" is your 1203/drive;

I'm glad the little adventure of fixing the 1203 is over, but sadly it didn't improve my connectivity issue, I'm just back where I was previously. The PC side of things is configured correctly (as per the manual and my screenshot above). Do you know how the 1203 itself should be configured? I have it as RTU Master with Node Address of 1. The drive is also configured with a node address of 1. This combination of settings is the only one that makes the status light blink green (which, as you say, is a good sign). But still I get no DSI node show up in RSLinx.

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The 1203 itself doesn't have a configuration, per-se. You download the 1203 Windows driver from Rockwell's PCDC site, then configure the RSLinx driver for the 1203 application you plan to use it for. You can also download and flash the 1203's firmware, but there are only three versions to choose from. Frankly, I have no idea what version of FW I have on mine; I only know that when I set up the RSLinx driver as shown in the book, it's worked every time, without fail.

Most networks don't allow the same node number to be used for different devices. You said you have both RSLinx driver and the VFD set as node 1; try changing one of them to something else.

Also, I've been wondering something throughout this thread; what Kinetix features are in FW Rev 2.3 that you must have this upgrade from 2.0? 

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12 hours ago, ElectronGuru said:

The 1203 itself doesn't have a configuration, per-se. You download the 1203 Windows driver from Rockwell's PCDC site, then configure the RSLinx driver for the 1203 application you plan to use it for. You can also download and flash the 1203's firmware, but there are only three versions to choose from.

There are a few config options on the 1203, you have to set them by connecting to it with a serial terminal (the manual talks about using HyperTerminal, which shows its age) and you're presented with a text based menu of settings. See Appendix E in the manual. If you can get RSLinx to talking to it, you can set these options in CCW as well. These include options like the adapter's mode. The default is Auto, and if you never had to change your settings, I assume that's what it must still be in. It also makes sense that Auto would do the job, but it isn't for me. The only way to get my 1203 to look happy with the drive (green flashing status light) is to manually set the adapter to RTU Master mode.

12 hours ago, ElectronGuru said:

Most networks don't allow the same node number to be used for different devices. You said you have both RSLinx driver and the VFD set as node 1; try changing one of them to something else.

The RSLinx driver has an id of 0. The drive has an ID of 1. I'm setting the ID on the 1203 (through the menu on the serial console) to 1, but I think that's telling the1203 the device ID of the connected drive, rather than giving the 1203 itself an ID. Either way, if the ID set on the 1203 matches the ID on the drive, I get a green flashing light, if they don't match I get red flashing. The odd thing is though, and this may have a lot to do with the problem, that the Kinetix 3 manual says I should set the drive's ID (Pr0.07) to 248 to connect it to CCW with a 1203 (drives-um001_-en-p.pdf, p87) but this isn't possible, the drive won't let me set above 247.

12 hours ago, ElectronGuru said:

Also, I've been wondering something throughout this thread; what Kinetix features are in FW Rev 2.3 that you must have this upgrade from 2.0? 

Not so much wanting more features, as making sure it has less bugs. The release notes list half a dozen fixes, one of which has to do with configuring serial communication (which may be relevant here???). Maybe these aren't an issue and I know there is an argument for 'if it's not broken don't fix it'. I'm starting to wonder if the combination of being Series A and the existing firmware version mean that the drive simply doesn't talk to RSLinx/CCW/etc. Maybe I need to try and find an older version of the manual and see if PC connection with a 1203 was only added after a certain point.

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Getting the 1203 running has been a side-issue that we were hoping would allow you to get your Kinetix firmware updated. The fact that it won't update through Ultraware was concerning. If the drives are working and otherwise accessible through Ultraware, I'd just as soon leave well enough alone. But that 1203 issue still bugs me to the core, lol. Sounds like you have the right idea, pulling up the manual that goes with that exact model and FW. Looking forward to hearing if it holds any solutions.

I've been furloughed for about there months but will be back in action next week, June 15th. If we haven't figured it out by then, I'll be close to some motion control drives experts and can pick their brains on this a bit.

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So I can't seem to let this go (I really need to get off this furlough) and pulled up the 1203 user manual.......

I am not well versed in HyperTerminal, but I understand that it is a communications and terminal emulator software that was introduced back in the days of dial-up network modems. Though you can set up a virtual back plane driver in RSLinx for use with things like Studio5000 Emulate, RSLinx is not designed (that I am aware of) for use with HyperTerminal. I'm using RSLinx Classic V4.11 and can't find anything in it that indicates otherwise but again, HyperTerminal is not my wheelhouse.

In the 1203 user manual, Appendix E's title is, "Use with HyperTerminal Software", and it specifically describes using HyperTerminal with Windows. RSLinx is not mentioned anywhere that I could find in Appendix E and therefore, I don't believe changing HyperTerminal settings on the 1203 would be helpful with getting an RSLinx connection established for CCW or DriveExecutive. Though I haven't tested this, I can see how changing the 1203's parameters for use with one format (ie HyperTerminal) could possibly interfere with the proper functioning of a different format (any RSLinx driver). 

I have unboxed many 1203s over the years and never changed the parameters, or have even had to update firmware. I would set the 1203 back to its factory defaults, set up an RSLinx serial DF1 driver for it (refer to chapter 3 or Appendix D of the 1203 user manual), then try to communicate with any available PowerFlex drive you have at your disposal, using either CCW or DriveExec. This will ensure the 1203 is working properly, and we can then concentrate solely on what witchcraft we'll have to come up with to get your Kinetix firmware updated.

You're in a Catch-22 on that Kinetix 248 address setting, because you need to upgrade the FW to make it available. Again, you probably have the right idea digging up a manual that covers Kinetix 3, V2.0. 

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I've managed to find version A of the Kinetix 3 manual, which presumably is from the time of Series A and it doesn't mention the 1203-usb at all. Current version of the manual is E (and never distinguishes any content between Series A & B), and has change bars next to the 1203 stuff in Table 1 - Kinetix 3 Drive System Overview but not in other places where the 1203 is mentioned (so it's probably just that table that was updated at this revision). I can't find any version in between A and E so not sure exactly when the rest came in. I don't even know the date of the previous version from the back cover, because they have incorrectly stated which manual it supersedes. Not the worst error I've found in the manuals since I've been looking at these drives, but I am surprised how many errors there are in them. As you say, getting the 1203 working was a side issue, as it seemed like it may help to get the firmware updated. Ultraware does have the option to update the firmware over RS232, but it refuses. It seems odd that you can download the newest firmware but there is no way to use it. Perhaps they didn't add the ability to update firmware until a version later than 2.00, but that would seem very short sighted.

If you do bump in to anyone who might be able to shed some light on this it'd be great to know, but I think it's probably time to give up trying to update the firmware on these. I do I appreciate all the help though, so thank you for looking at this with me.

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