Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
panic mode

Durable Laptop With Real Serial Port

21 posts in this topic

I don't know how many are looking for new laptop but it still seam to be important to get one with real serial port, preferably robust one that can take some abuse and maybe survive drop or two. Just noticed interesting article and tought others might find it interesting too: http://www.mobilityguru.com/2006/03/21/tor...head/index.html It sure seam to be on pair in terms of performance with my Dell, but better protected. Display is only 1024x768 which is too small for my taste but for price of only $1,650 seam to be very inexpencive (about 1/2 price of what my company has paid for my current laptop).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm not trying to turn this thread in a different direction, but I think this is a subject that needs to be addressed too. How many of you have began implementing plans for when serial ports are no longer available. They are getting harder to find everyday. As far as your question. I used a Dell before my current laptop. I feel they have the best selection for the money as far as laptops that still have a serial port at a decent price but they do not have all the bells and whistles of most new laptops. My new laptop does not have a serial port. We no longer accept machines that require a serial port to connect to. Ethernet to serial port adapters are allowed as long as they can be configured from the Ethernet side

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Try a couple of these links. Getac Crystalpc Itronix Edited by Camel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi TW, That's interesting topic too. We still get to use tons of devices with RS232 although most are Ethernet. I do make recommendations but I'm not trying to avoid RS232, since we have limited control on hardware selection anyway (customer specs...). Customers get what they want but they may not like it in a long run. Most of them are really hard to convince too and I find the best way to educate people is to follow their wishes, specially when they make poor choices so current situation is fine by me. After all they are customers and it's not good idea to make ultimatums even if it's for their own good. Most of them are afraid of Ethernet simply because they don't know anything about it. People who want to be able to do work will always get proper tools if that's what they have to deal with, regardless of cost or popularity. Someone will just have to pay for it, even if it's Laptop with serial port. I agree about Dells cost but in my case company is paying for it, and I was told it just has to be Dell. After pondering this (only) limitation I decided to choose the best money could buy (I would not go this way if I had to pay for it but hey). I'm quite happy with it and nobody complained about it - in fact we bought few more of them for other guys. It’s not rugged as the mentioned products above but it has thing I like such as huge and brilliant high resolution display, fast graphic card that handles everything I can throw at it, lots or RAM, nice keyboard, fast CPU, 7200RPM HDD, DL DVD burner, gigabit Ethernet, wireless Ethernet, speakers that actually could be used to enjoy music (unlike beepers in my old laptop), fire-wire, plenty of USB ports etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Thanks for the comments Panic Mode Just wanted to make a few comments. You got me thinking when you mentioned that you "have limited control on hardware selection anyway (customer specs...)." So why would I spec that machines must be able to connect to Ethernet. By the way, I fall into the classification of a customer. When you have various PLCs, you can end up running around the plant with a bucket of cables when troubleshooting. Then you can only connect to one device at a time with your serial port usually. With serial, you are constantly plugging and unplugging cables. And older software sometimes seems to hang the serial port and a reboot is the only way to get it to release it. Some of our programming points are well over 200' from the PLC. Way too far for serial. And these are not necessarily complex machines that would have networked I/O. Plus we eventually connect most of our machines to the plant network. I know a lot of OEMs get dollar signs in there eyes when they hear that, I used too, but not a hard or expensive task to design the controls for Ethernet. Why Ethernet? While many are not sold on Ethernet, on thing it has going for it is almost all PLC manufacturers making Ethernet interfaces. And before the Devicenet, Controlnet and other networking guys jump in, I use distributed I/O also. Mainly Devicenet, I have never had a chance to use Controlnet. But if it is big enough for distributed I/O, you can add a Ethernet module too. Edited by TWControls

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
And yes, I have huge bag loaded with all kinds of cables. Never know who is going to call next so I have to keep them all handy. Not just PLCs, there are HMIs, servos, nutrunners, PCs, all kinds of networks and who knows what not... I'm sold on ethernet, but not everybody else is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Edited by Pierre

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Whenever possible i design a system so i can communicate with it via Ethernet or USB. If I must use serial, I usually use the Belken Serial to USB adapter, Part # F5U109, price about $29 It has drivers that work for almost every device. I did find an old Red Lion HMI that it didn't work with though $ Edited by Money4Nothing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Scope is great tool and I love it. I was reverse-engineering some protocols and so far I was able to do it without scope but if that's what you want, why can't you do the same with ethernet? Even if the scope is slow, it is enough to run cables through older hub or switch with 10Mbps. That will enforce use of lower speed but message will still be the same.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You probably can, at least as long as you consider signal degradation (ie probably, you'll have to use a probe). Still, it doesn't make sence to use an expensive oscilloscope, when the program Ethereal has extensive network traffic tracking and networking protocol analysis possibilities. To do something with a scope (especially one without any possibility to save "one-time" signals, like most digital ones but only very few analog ones) would probably take at least 10x the time. More if using complex protocols like TCP. There is a downside though and that is that you need a computer as one of the endpoints - but you already suggested the solution - just use a hubbed network instead of the usual switched. Then all traffic will hit all network interfaces on the LAN.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
My company Snarl's At anything with a serial Port: and Customers that Want Serial Comm's A directly taken outta the 60's Mindset and Brought into the Current Communications Mediums: "we trash anything with RS232 on it" Who in gods name uses that Old crap

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
ugh - interesting first post. Reviving a thread that's going on 2 years old, the meaningful message, grammar. Welcome to mrplc!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hi Nathan, well you may be surprised... let me see, maybe changing "the best way to educate" to "the easiest way to educate" would be closer to what i meant. your post made it look like i either don't care or maybe even try to punish them for something and that's personal so let me try to explain: that is far from truth, let me assure you that i do my very best to help each and every customer get the very best solution for their need. i do that with passion in my every post in public forums (not something i get paid for). we do have many customers, most are returning over and over again and that must count for something. some are much more knowledgable than others and those don't really need to be educated, they are already observant, know how to listen and ask for advice before making big or costly decisions or bankrupting themselvs. i wish i could say they are all like that. but i also have to emphasize that my time and energy are NOT endless resources. i love what i do and i enjoy my work (well, at least most of the time) but ultimately i am not some don quixote, i only work to live/survive on certain standard i have chosen for myself and my family, also meaning to afford it i still have to follow rules of those who eventually sign the check or make direct deposit to my account at the end of pay period. further this means i have to produce results at certain deadlines and customers do deserve royal treatment (nothing wrong that they pay for it, this is why they come to us). in other words why stay in a way of a project after numerous meetings and emails have underlined that customer wants something his/her/their way? after all they are paying for it, they deserve to have input and why not give them final word? yes, in the end it may cost them more (sometimes considerably more) but who am i to question how others spend their own money? i can only offer honest advice or recommendation but they can still have my services in support of their dream (even though it may not be my dream exactly...). ps. i am not trying to be the "wise guy" either (you never know when you may run into someone like terminator from mad tv).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hi, I'm in process of buying a new laptop for my PLC's applications but I'm having hard time trying to find the right one, could you please give me some advice on this matter? I'll really appreciate your help. Thanks, Robert.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Talk to dell. They will still build you a laptop with a serial port. They will even instal a PCMA slot if you ask. I am not sure if the will still do XP on request though. As for the why serial question. I use serial for legacy equipment. I try not to purchase new equipment that requires serial comuncation. Key word is try. For a machine where I would use a Dl or a Micro serial is still the flavor of choice. Kinda had to justify the added expense of ethernet when other than conneting to the device it is not needed. Like it or not serial is probably going to still be around long after alot of us retire. HEck in my company we still have machines running on TI5's. A serial port would be an upgrade.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I find my dell ATG to be perfect for site work....not quite in the same category as a panasonic toughbook (my dream laptop) :-p. It handles everything I've thrown at it so far without a problem and the screen is superb!. Nice built in serial port and plenty of connectivity. Price wise a bit on the steep side but...but if you keep an eye on ebay they do appear from time to time. (I got mine new and boxed from ebay at 50pc the full Dell price! , ) As for the serial/usb debate, usb is certainly quicker but i am the only one that finds usb a bit quirky???. Serial ports are certainly more mechanically robust, thats about the only advantage I see them having these days. Dirt in usb ports can cause endless problems when on site.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sorry to bring up this older thread. It has a relevant title This one is more for the Aussies and Kiwis. I went to a 'supposed' laptop specialist to buy a new windows XP pro laptop with a serial port. This 'supposed' specialist could only find me refurbished ones and what I think to be a slightly over priced Dell latitude. Anyway took it upon myself to find me one for reasonable amount of money and found this... http://laptop.com.au/product_info.php/manu...products_id/494 I think with these types of laptops becoming very tough to come buy, anyone that is in the market for one would like to have a look at this. I think its a good find. It is a grey import but they will match the warranty all be it only locally. Can't wait mine is in the post.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lol - this is one of those threads that will never die - Like the infamous PLC law thread!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
let me just Clarify something, I've been involved in the Control Industry for almost 15 years, I have many various Allen Bradley Certifications, ("Regrettably")I've been involved in many projects involving serial Connections,and anyone("customers -vendors") that hasn't been in or knowledgeable about Ethernet control really doesn't understand what is better, so your saying u can sell a customer a pentium II PC and run there scada and sell it to them for $2,000 (absolute Insane thinking) we do updated control systems, 95% of our projects involve ripping out 30 year old serial and relay controlled plc's and replacing it with (" Current to-date ") Control, grab some trade magazines, read

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Who is your comment directed toward? I'm missing the point. Integrators are asking about current equipment with a serial port so that they can service their customer's legacy installations. Beyond that, serial ports are used with modern equipment - PLCs, routers and switches, etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0