www.cadllp.com

[TimWilborne 108]

Has anyone ever bought anything off of www.cadllp.com. My boss found them serveral months ago and had me look into them. They say they can save you over 25% on sealed plc parts. I called and there is a message saying something about they have gotten so busy that they pretty much do not take phone calls anymore because the are on jobsites but you can email them. They have no physical address and no apparent way to personally talk to them. I figured they were a scam but I just saw them advertised at the top of this forum.

[Ken Moore 23]

Never heard of them before. I have used www.plccenter.com for a lot of AB stuff and would recommend them. Only had one hiccup in about 5 years, and they corrected the problem right away.

[Mickey 71]

The site is pretty; Their address is on there web site Creative Analog & Digital, LLP 48 Wyoming Avenue Tunkhannock, PA 18657 P.S. No I don't work for them Edited 27 Dec 2005 by Mickey

[TimWilborne 108]

Ok I see there address now. But is it just me or does it seem strange that you can't talk to anyone there. They suggest you email them

[hakko808 0]

Not all that strange in some ways. I have done business with a few internet based businesses like this, mostly computer parts. Some are part time ventures, some just do not want to spend the money on phone staff, and want to cater to those who know exactly what they want, some do not speak english well enough to talk on the phone. Most will have a customer service number on the invoice though in case something goes wrong. I just make sure to pay by credit card so that the charges can be disputed if need be. I would not recommend PLC Direct. Three orders this year, and three problems. Slow turn around since they do not test anything until it is ordered, and inventory control is questionable. Should not take two weeks to test supposedlly new product or to figure out that it is not in stock.

[TimWilborne 108]

I guess I am just a little hesitant of internet orders and some of their plc parts with a factory seal are extremely cheap. Sounds too good to be true but I guess only one way to find out. I still get scared ordering off of Ebay.

[jstolaruk 9]

It usually is.

[Contr_Conn 4]

They probably real, selling stuff they buying from others and over various auctions. This is a very profitable business lately. But: - this is most likely one man operation, may be two - for sure they have no time to pick up the phone. May be basement operation. I know this from my own experience. - What are you going to do if module is bad? Where to call? - Who will provide warranty? A-B? I don't think so. plccenter or tek-supply - these are two places I know. PLCcenter is a bigger place but they buy and sell ebay stuff. Tek-supply is 1-1/2 man operation - owner and secretary. Edited 29 Dec 2005 by Contr_Conn

[gravitar 3]

When you buy from someone on the internet, you do take a calculated risk. It can be quite a different experience from dealing with the likes of A-B. Many have learned how to deal sensibly over the internet and manage the risk, others are less comfortable doing so. There's nothing wrong with either way of thinking, its completely up to the individual if they're willing to weigh some risk against a potentially MUCH better deal. I've been buying and selling PLCs on ebay for several years now, and business gets better every year. Its fun because I get to experiment with a wide variety of equipment before I actually have a need for it out in the field.

[TimWilborne 108]

I here a lot of you talk about buying parts off of Ebay. Have any of you had any trouble doing this?

[Ken Moore 23]

I have bought and sold a few automation products on Ebay, mostly "brick" plc's, a few "classic" PLC-5's and power supplies. You have to use the same caution you would use when buying anything on ebay. So far I've had good results. When something was promised to work it did. There are sometimes whole lots of I/O modules without any warranty, but they are usually pretty cheap, and you can find enough good ones to make it worth you while. Most commercial/industrial companies don't do ebay purchases because down time is much more costly than the hardware. You don't want to take a line down for repair and have the supposed spare turn out to be bad off the shelf. On top of that, it would be hard to justify a position where the only duty was to hang out on ebay and buy company spares. There are a couple of the reason's that ebay prices are so low, lack of demand. In my opinion the people doing most of the buying are small outfits where money is tight or individuals.

[TimWilborne 108]

Yes the more I think about it, it is probably better to stick with the normal distributors than to take the chance getting burnt. Like it was stated earlier, where would I go if there was a problem with the product? I can't seem to contact this company personally so if I had a problem and needed something really fast I don't think they would be much help.

[Contr_Conn 4]

I bought and sold stuff on ebay, most of controls items came exactly as described. I don't need to to this now, but in any case I would buy brand new parts from distributor for important customer. For cheap customers with junk machines - anything is good. They looking at the price only.

[TimWilborne 108]

I don't miss the cheap customers who want junk machines at all. I have a job doing automation in house now but still do many jobs on the side. Although I have lost a lot of work with the decision and it made finding work very hard at first, I decided a few years ago to turn down those type of jobs. The customer is going to get what they pay for but it always ends up making you look bad when you put one of these "junk machines" in even when it is exactly what the customer specified. It has taken much longer this way, but over time I have built up a good customer base and when I put a system in, I know that it will work. Plus past quality work is the best referral you can give to a new potential customer

[TimWilborne 108]

Maybe I should rephase my origonal question. What I am trying to do is get parts for testing proposed project programs. Most of my customers use Misubishi or AB. I have most of the Misubishi Plcs, and the small AB Plcs and even a basic Controllogix setup. There are a few Controllogix parts I would like to get but mainly I need a PLC5 for testing. I use a SLC for testing PLC5 programs but there a some minor programming variations and communicaions is much different. I am afraid that these are going to end up burning me on a project. I hear some of you talk about testing PLC5 programs here. Where did you get your parts. I really can't afford a PLC5 at the normal price just for testing since this is more for side jobs. We don't have any PLC5s where I work. But I still don't want to get burnt Edited 1 Jan 2006 by TWControls

[hakko808 0]

Doubtfull you will find much of the older stuff NIB, but for your application it sounds like a good used one should do fine. Just a few notes on what I have found on e-bay. "Untested' can often be translated as "broken junk" especially if the seller has many similar items that just happen to be tested. Feedback can be a good indicator to see how much industrial stuff a seller has been involved in. Just click on item numbers in feedback profile to get a feeling of what type of items the seller has been selling. One industrial piece in the middle of a bunch of craft or rummage stuff is usally a warning sign. Watch for listings that offer a 10 or 15 day return policy. Avoid sellers who only take money orders. Aviod sellers who do not post freight charges up front. Finally exect no customer service from e-bay as the operation is essentially automated.

[gravitar 3]

One of my regular customers is a "junk" one like you've described. It isn't his fault, it just so happend that nearly ALL the screw machine work has gone to China and he's desperately trying to stick it out! Automatic screw machines are interesting beasts. Mechanically, they are extremely complex and sophisticated. When they were first developed nearly a century ago, they had to rank among the most complex mechanisms ever designed by man. Electrically though, there's not much to 'em. In fact, electricity was optional.. As recent at 30 years ago there were screw houses that had a driveshaft running the length of the shop with leather straps "powering" the machines! Anyway, the reason why I mention this is because when I first walked into this shop 4 years ago, all his equipment was AT LEAST 60 years old, controls and all. Most of it was WW-II Army surplus. These machines were still humming away, cranking out parts at a frantic pace, just like they did 60+ years earlier up the road at the Warren Tank Arsenal. Anyway, that was ALL the guy knew. Sure, he had HEARD of programmable controls, but for him it was a "luxury" that would cost him an arm-and-a-leg for some hot-shot programmer to build for him. He knew relays, understood them.. And he was going to keep on building his machines with relays come hell or high water. I was determined to at least bring him into the 1980s though.. I convinced him that I could build a machine for him using a PLC, and it would be CHEAPER than using the old 700P control relays he already had. The way I did it was to buy a SLC 150 off ebay. I think I paid about $30 for it. Sure, I took a chance that it wouldn't work. But at that price, I'd say it was worth the risk! He realized a cost savings by the greatly-reduced mounting and wiring labor, and total lack of re-wiring every time he changed the specs on me :) So anyway, it is now fair to say he is sold on the virtues of solid-state controls. I still use SLC 100 and 150s there, because they continue to be a very cost-effective relay replacement solution. They're dang near bulletproof too, which is good because it is a VERY oily, nasty environment. I've gone in there to see SLC 100s in operation that were literally dripping with cutting oil when they forgot to close the panel door! I don't work for this guy to get rich obviously.. It is more just for the satisfaction of building something. He may be what other people pass up as "junk" but even a cheap-booty like me can afford to help a guy out every now and then..

[gravitar 3]

Noone "wants" to get burnt, of course, in anything they do. Like I said before, its the concept of managed risk. If you have a 401K at work, you know about this. They offer several investment options.. there's the "guaranteed return" fund, that is virtually risk free but offers a next-to-nothing interest rate. A guaranteed loser in my book! At the other end of the spectrum are international growth funds that carry a significantly greater risk, but give you the chance for a much greater rate of return. Of course, there's various bond and stock funds inbetween that have varying levels of risk and return. So you could say that buying something new from A-B is the "guaranteed return" fund.. You can rest assured that you aren't taking any risk, but then again it is a pretty costly proposition.. You can buy from a "recognised brand" reseller, and take a little risk of potential defects in order to get a somewhat better price than new material from A-B.. Or, you could choose to take a somewhat higher chance and buy something off ebay. Of course there's varying risk levels on ebay too, but let's just simplify things by not getting into that. In exchange for this risk, there is the potential to get a VERY, VERY good deal. For example, it isn't hard to get a SLC 5/01 processor for $10, a 1747-A7 rack and power supply for $50-75 each, a 1746-IB16 for $25, or a 1747-L532 for $100. I think you know what these go for in the A-B price book! Umm.. Yeah, for my money I'll take the chance. I inspect and test everything thoroughly when I receive it, and make sure I have a contingency plan (spares) incase something DOES fail. The spread is naturally even GREATER for PLC-5, but SLC prices are the ones I can speak to offhand. But, lucky for us, this stuff is highly reliable and designed for long life, anyway.. In my experience failures are pretty rare. Its not like we're talking about used Mitsumi floppy drives or Samsung VCRs! I dunno, draw your own conclusions.. but for just a test/training setup to use at home, it seems like a no-brainer to me!

[TimWilborne 108]

Thanks for the advice everyone. I think I will play with Ebay some in the future. As for the PLC5 I talked to a buddy who has a suitcase demo PLC5 and he said I could use it to do my testing. It has the basic I/O, chassis, and processor so that will cut the cost down tremendously.