cajunconfigurator

Quick Panel (TCP model) Upload

17 posts in this topic

Hello All, 

I have an older Total Control Quick Panel QPI2D100L2P 10.4 inch Monochrome that I am trying to retrieve the program on. The original programmer is unknown and we do not have a copy of the program. The screen has gone out on this panel.

I am using quickdesigner on an XP virtual machine. I have the correct programming cable the 8 pin DIN connector HMI-CAB-C49-J

When I connect to the HMI, The software "sees" that the HMI is connected and says "waiting for the Display to be ready" then times out and tells me "the display is Hung" and another message "Turn display OFF" when I turn it off the software gives me the message "Turn Display ON" then when I turn it on, the software goes to "waiting for the Display device to be ready" and just sit there. Nothing more. I have waited for 20 mins for it to progress and nothing. 

At first I thought maybe the Panel that I am working on is just bad. However I get the same indications on another, same model, quick panel that IS working just fine. 

I know this is older stuff. And ProFace Support (who took over making the replacements from TCP) wont support using quick designer on anything other than a Win 2K machine or older. 

Anyone have experience with these panels?

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We've had unreliable results using an XP virtual machine with QuickDesigner but fairly good results using it in an XP host.  What are you using for a serial port?  The best results we've gotten with the VM have been with a Keyspan adapter connected to the VM so the Keyspan software and drivers are in the VM.  I don't think we ever got it to work passing the built-in serial port to the VM.

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Joe E, Thanks for the info. I am using the physical serial port, and I have a prolific USB / Serial. I installed the Prolific Drivers on the VM and using the USB adapter is transparent to the software, as the drivers add a COM 3 port, and I just pointed the quick courier (upload software) to the com 3. Based on the Tech Support recommendations I have stopped using the dongle and just gone to using the physical port. But I am not so sure that the virtual handling of the physical port across the VM is not what is causing the problem. 

I built a win2K pro VM last night, as the ProFace USA Tech Support (the only people offering any support for these) recommended. got the same indications. They seem to think that the problem is with 1) the tool port on the HMI or 2) the com port is being taken over by another software. 

I doubt its the tool port, because I am trying to connect with the same indications on 2 HMI's. So you know basic troubleshooting is... whats common? the com port. 

I am thinking that I am going to have to build an XP partition on my laptop, or a Win2K partition and try that way 

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If you can easily build an XP or 2K partition, that would be cleaner and have fewer things to go wrong.  I would probably try swapping the hard drive real quick with a spare and putting XP/2K on that as a test before monkeying with partitions.

We've kept an old desktop computer with WinXP for stuff like this and have 2 Panasonic Toughbooks with native com ports, one of which has WinXP still.  For some reason, the desktop is more reliable connecting to the TCPs than the laptop, even though they both have native COM ports and the same exact version of Windows.

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I have never had good luck using a generic USB to Serial Device.

Find a PC with a real serial port either on the PC or a docking station.

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Joe E. That is a really good Idea to build a separate hard drive with an XP. Unfortunately real quick is not a word when you are in the middle of the Gulf of Mexico and you need parts. I screwed my laptop pretty badly yesterday after partitioning. The MBR got hosed and UBCD was not able to fix it. Luckily I am smart enough to have made an image of my drive before I started partitioning. It took forever to image and recover using macrium, but think god I took the time to image it. We also found the HMI-CAB -C49 cable I have here has shorts across three pins and all three are shorted to the backshell of the mini din connector. So we pulled the panel and put it on the boat going in for an RMA repair. 

Russ, I agree. I almost always use the native serial port on this machine. Working across a VM makes that a bit hairy that is why I use the USB / Serial. In this case the issue had to be the cable. I am still not sure if the quickdesigner will work across a VM but I will let you guys know. 

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I have had QuickDesigner work inside a VM with a Keyspan COM port adapter, but it's not as reliable as in the host OS.  Are you sure those pins aren't supposed to be shorted?  Or that they're really shorted and you're not reading through the electronics inside?  I can dig out our cable and compare readings if you want.

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Joe E no I am not sure that they arent supposed to be we are assuming. The pins  1, 4, and 6 per this drawing (sent from ProFace,) have continuity together and have continuity to the mini DIN backshell If you wouldnt mind checking your cable that would be amazing. the drawing shows the jumper placement on the HMI port side for a tool port test. but referencing it to the mini din side of the cable those are the pin numbers with continuity. 

 

HMI Pins.JPG

Edited by cajunconfigurator
Clarity of drawing

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We have a Pro-face cable GPW-CB02.  When probing the D-sub end, pins 6 and 8 are shorted to each other, none others.  I didn't find continuity between any of the pins in the round connector at all.  I then checked end-to-end.  The Tool Port connector shown in the image looks just like it's the same pin arrangement as if you're looking at the end of our cable.

The only way I found end-to-end continuity was shell to shell and round pin 1 (using the numbers in your picture) to d-shell pin 5.

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Joe, thank you very much, I am going to get some pin extenders and check it again. If I find the same as we did before I am going to call it a bad cable. The cable I have here is a HMI-CAB-C49-J. Which is the same as the HMI-CAB-C49, shipped with the TCP quick panel junior. 

If you want to ship me yours, Ill trade you. I have a semi-trainable operator named Ronoo. and I'll throw in a $100 walmart gift card?  

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I might be up for it if we didn't still have a few of these panels to support here.  Once we get rid of the last ones, we'll be interested in disposing of our spare panels and the cable.  Unfortunately we only have the one cable.

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So I used some of the fluke clips and made some tiny leads out of stretched open paper clips, put the cable in a soldier "third hand" station with a magnifying glass, made sure there are no jumpers in the dsub side and the first two pins I touched had continuity. All in all I got the same readings I got before. 3 pins, continuity across them, and continuity on each to the mini din backshell. 

I am going to say that this cable has to be a problem. Thank you much for all the help. 1000 points to you kind Sir. How do I give you some reputation or +1 or something? 

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Glad to help.  Since it's a different cable, it may be wired differently inside, but I wouldn't expect that much difference if both cables are supposed to do the same thing.  You might try to get in touch with ProFace to see what they say about readings pin-to-pin and end-to-end.  I tried to use an unbent paperclip but didn't have enough hands, so I used a 9-pin d-sub breakout connector for the PC end and tried to juggle the HMI end.  It was awkward and I may have missed something...

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Joe, I fired off an email to proface tech support (who have been amazingly helpful throughout this ordeal) to ask about the readings we are seeing. That drawing is actually for the GPW-CB02, they told me over the phone the CB02 is the same as the HMI-C49, but I am emailing just to confirm again. 

When I did work as a Navy contractor on submarines, and did ALOT of troubleshooting RS232 and RS422 communications I used to carry a little kit with a DB25 pin breakout box, and would use the 25 to 9 pin converters to bring signals to the bob. We also built all the cables with the crimped and pushed in style d sub headers, and the backshells were all screw together not molded. I am really missing my little kit with the break out box and the female and male pins right now. 

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Joe, You wouldnt be able to measure the voltage out of the Mini DIN side for me would you? I am considering building a new cable, but it has that TTL board in there. I am just wondering what logic level the TTL is using? I know the PC port puts out about 13VDC for the RS232, I am assuming that the TTL is likely at 5V, but knowing GE it could be something really weird and super proprietary. 

 

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Get one of these for about $50 and you will be good to go. I have tested it in the W7 Virtual XP-Mode add-on, and in the W7 host, works great.

http://www.plccable.com/ge-quickpanel-quickdesigner-proficy-me-view-gp-propb-hmi-cable-proface-usb-gpw-cb03-a-gpw-cb02/

 

Edited by RussB

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We've used other cables from plccable.com with excellent results.  I wouldn't be afraid to try that one at all.

 

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