Thermo

What do I need to get started?

37 posts in this topic

17 hours ago, gtsuport said:

Ian,

I know I am joining this thread late in the game, but had a thought.

You should be able to download the trial version of CX-One.  This is a large file, and it would only work for 30 days.  However, there is an Auto Online function in that software that should be able to sort out the comm parameters for your CPM1A. 

Once you have those parameters, you should be able to enter that information into Syswin and hopefully connect.

If you are unable to locate a download link for the CX-One Trial, let us know and we can provide a link.

Hope this will help.

Gtsuport,

You are not only incredibly handsome and charming but you are also a genius!!  What a brilliant idea (although this does not at all diminish BobB's generous offer to try my 'brick' with his Auto Online function...).

It's taken all of my Saturday and half my monthly data allowance but I finally managed to download CX-One Trial and install it.  (Being is such a remote outback location (i.e. less than 2 hours from the state capital, Brisbane), we have third world or lesser internet access here...)

Once I finally got it all working, Auto Online did indeed 'find' my CPM1A's comms settings - 19200 baud, 1, 7, 2, even.  The suspect Chinese USB adapter/cable preformed faultlessly.  I was able to upload the old PLC program etc.

Then switched over to Win xp mode and Syswin, plugged in the appropriate comms settings, and Hey Presto! - it worked!  Many thanks to all who contributed.

The current state of play is that I selected Online/Clear memory/All Areas/OK - and it's still going.  How long should this take?

Thanks again all,

Ian

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8 hours ago, BobB said:

I am not sure if auto online works with the CPM1A or not - trying to find one to try it. He can post it too me and I will try it for him. We are in touch by PM. I do have some doubts about the Chinese cable but it may be OK.

Hi Bob,

As per my reply above to Gtsuport, it seems your idea of trying Auto Onlne worked - and after much effort to get CX-One Trail working, it did indeed reveal my PLC's comms setup.

Thanks very much for your help to date and your generous offer to try to communicate with my obsolete plastic brick for me.

Ian.

PS: The Chinses USB cable/adapter seems to be working OK - but this Clear All Memory seems to be taking an awful long time.  Does it have to write a '0' individually to even bit in memory?

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What do you mean by clearing the memory? 

I mean, what is your need?

Edited by pfort

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Hi pfort,

It's all good now - was my misunderstanding.  I wanted to clear the memory settings and old program so I knew exactly the state of the PLC before downloading my program.  I used the function shown below.

Now since I used this function, I've successfully downloaded my  program and uploaded it again to check it, and run monitoring mode etc. and all seems to be working perfectly.  However, since doing the memory clear, the comms LED and the USB adapter TX/RX  LED have been flickering constantly.  I mistook this for the 'memory clear' process taking forever, but it seems to be 'normal' for my set-up.  Does this sound right?

In any case, thank you for your help.

Ian

Screen image 1.jpg

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Yes the comms light will flicker when communicating. Got lucky with the cheapy as well - bonus! The ZEN is OK but is just a relay replacement toy - I have not used one for many years to be honest. First problem is you cannot do online programming and I will not wear that at all! Also an issue with the latest PLCs if you want to insert FBs - have to stop the PLC - I use very few FBs because of that. You will not be able to go online with the new PLCs and Syswin though - only the old tigers.

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Hi Bob,

Yes, I'm a happy little Vegemite now.

1 hour ago, BobB said:

Also an issue with the latest PLCs if you want to insert FBs - have to stop the PLC - I use very few FBs because of that.

Gees, that would be annoying.  I know this is no place to re-start the old PLC Vs DCS discussion (for one thing, I'd be outnumbered about 1,000,000 to 1!) but clunky as it was, the old Yokogawa uXL (read: micro-XL, the little brother to Centum XL, late '80s to late '90s vintage) and it's successors, were brilliant in that regard.  Very little you couldn't do on-line/hot.  

Changing analog signal conditioner cards, AIO and DIO cards and even processor cards in dual-redundant systems could all be done hot and on-line (with due regard to the effects on the process during changeover, of course).  And analog control blocks and sequence tables could be added/edited on-line.  [Sequence Table: think of a block of up to 32 rungs of ladder with up to 32 contacts and 32 coils per rung.  Packs a lot of logic into a small space.]

Ah, enough reminiscing for now...

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DCS is OK - but not for controlling anything that moves even fairly slowly. Good for A/C as nothing moves fast there. The remore I/O system I prefer updates 1000 I/O very quickly - a slow PLC scan time these days for me is 15 milliseconds - huge program. I see DCS systems scanning at 30-60 seconds regularly. When controlling machinery I can see the sense in some things not being able to be done online as it could be disastrous!

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hmmm... 1000 digital i/o is a regular size plc project but imho DCS is quite another animal. grated last time i used DCS was in the late 90s. yes, the scan time was slower... (as slow as 0.5sec) but that was for a system with several thousands of PID loops (not to mention rest of the program), full redundancy, hot plugging of any module etc. i would like to see plc of today (2 decades later) that can match that. and i would be really impressed to of one that can do all that while maintain scan time of 15ms. ;-) 

 

 

 

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I think it probably depends on the DCS system as well. A couple I have seen lately have not been huge but have been very slow. Others have not been too bad. A current job I have going - for 5 years now and probably another 5 to go - is done with distributed PLCs and the overall system is very quick - a lot depends on the structure. Main PLC is a redundant CS1. I/O and peer to peer comms in most of the system are CompoNet and Controller Link but there is also some Ethernet. I am finding the Ethernet and Citect are the bottlenecks.

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Hi Bob & Mr Mode (or may I call you Panic?),

It's horses for courses, of course:-1.  DCS evolved for process control, PLC evolved for machine control.

While I had a little to do with Honeywell TDC2000 (yes, 2000) and quite a bit with Bailey Network 90 in the late '80s.  But most of my experience had been with Yokogawa DCS since the early '90s.  A big thing about the Yoko systems is that they are absolutely deterministic.  The proprietary comms bus had a 1 sec scan time no matter how many operator stations and controller nests were installed, up to the specified maximum (and even in the 'little' uXL system that could be a massive I/O count (100,000 tags from memory?)).  The standard controller scan time was 1 sec - rock solid, no variation - which is more than enough for 99% of analog control and non-machine digital control (motor control etc.).  Fast scan for a limited amount of the program was 200ms (stop laughing, this is serious!).  But this is good enough for compressor surge control.  The newer successors (Centum CS, CS3000, VP) offer scan  times for limited  areas down to 50 ms - but again rock solid guaranteed. 

I ran training on uXL for a while.  Sparkies/engineers with PLC backgrounds invariable scoff and laughed when the scan times came up but were generally impressed by the end of the training by the deterministic nature of the system and the simplicity of the total and tightl integration of the system.  Define a single DIO point or a PID control block and you automatically have a fully-featured faceplate for your HMI that is updated every second.

But, as I said, 'horses for courses'.  Ian

Edited by Thermo
corrected "of" to "or"
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Ian,

Really happy that worked for you.

I can understand the data allowance problem.  I am in a rural area and can only get satellite "high speed" internet.

Let us know if you have questions on the CPM1.

gtsuport

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Thanks GT.    I seem to have everything working well now and I've created a small program to add some 'smarts' to 1980s vintage sun-tracking solar hot water heater I acquired years ago.

Thanks again for your help and offer of future assistance.

Ian

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