junkyardgary

To Replace A series PLC's, What Mitsu series would you recommend?

5 posts in this topic

In my last plant, we used 100% Rockwell Allen Bradley PLC's. I was very familiar with replacing a SLC series with a 5000 series, a no brainer. Now I work in a foundry with 100% Mitsubishi A-series PLC's with a weird gateway coaxial loop communications that is way beyond it's service life. There is little no no support, and I have been tasked with updating it to something Ethernet based, and reliable. I would like to stick with Mitsubishi, for no other reason than to convert the code from the A series to the new series using my existing GX developer software. This is a running factory, no time to demo the old controls and spend weeks re-inventing the wheel with new Rockwell/Seimans/ect PLC's; plus I already have the software Despite a rather long learning curve, I've been getting comfortable using it. My question is: If you had to choose today what series to convert an entire plant, which would you go with, and why? Please keep in mind this is a foundry, its hot, dirty and nothing really needs to be high speed, or math intensive. I would like something easy to install, easy to expand, easy to use Mitsubishi HMI's and something the electricians can wire and repair (prefer screw terminals not spring terminals).

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Hi Junkyard Gary, I can recommend the Mitsubishi Q-series with built-in Ethernet port like Q03CPU as a good replacement. We are in the middle of that same process and the A-series have proven that this is a reliable brand for many years (over 15 years) There is also a catch! Before you plan to change note that the Q-series outputcards have sometimes just 1 common for all outputs. The A-series have most of the time at least two commons. Aldough the working of the outputs itself is the same still you have to keep in mind if a common is behind an emergencystop circuit all outputs of one card are off at the same time. If you have signal horns or pilot lights that have to warn your personell you need to keep these outputs alive in case of the emergency situation. Also the conversion of the software is not always 100%. you can do an automatic conversion in GX-Works2 but functions that are present in A-series are not always compatible with the Q-series. The programm shows special markers SM999 in the ladder diagram that means something like 'I don't know what to do with this instruction' so beware that you have to check for these tricks. As a HMI we are using Beijer MAC E-1000 series and are transferring to GT2000 touch screen HMI's from Mitsubishi. This new GT2000 line is very nice however the programming is very different and less friendly compared to the Beijer panels. If there is no need to change the HMI you can communicate also the old panel to the Q-series if there is an Ethernet connection available. It was a lot of work and a challange to make the first machine run but in the end we are glad we have choosen for Mitsubishi again. I Did not do this conversions myself, we hired a technician for it but I checked what he was doing along the project. I hope this was helpfull an succes with your challenge. Best regards, Theo V. Edited by Theo V

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Yes Theo, in fact that was very helpful. I am very familiar with the dual fed output cards used by A-B and Modicon both. I've also struggled with the update conversion blues a time or two, mostly easy fixes. I also loved the Beijer line of HMI's but was unaware they still made them. I had E615's, a few 1000's and loved how easy they were to use. Unfortunately my existing HMI's are GOT 70's, with no ethernet, basically too old to be of much use anyway. I have the software in-house already for the newer GOT's so that makes sense to stick with those; unless someone has a good reason to purchase another brand?? Uticor/Proface/Beijer/ect... I browsed the Q series hardware pages, it looks like good stuff. In fact I'm not sure why Mitsubishi carries so many different lines of PLC's. Edited by junkyardgary

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FYI There is a free tool (AQ conversion tool) you can download from the Mitsubishi site which will compare you're A series program with the converted system Q program. It will generate a HTML file which will show you exactly which parts have to be converted manually. There is also a way to convert your E HMI to a Got project check with your dealer. I agree with Theo the E terminals we're very easy to program. However the GOT's have more functionality and using the new template feature is really good.

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Mitsubishi offers hundreds of pages of conversion information, as well as a couple hundred parts which can be used to easily convert your A to Q. You won't have to replace it all, it can be done in stages, and it's very simple. And GX Developer does the program conversion, but some manual editing may be required depending on the complexity of the program. You can contact Mitsubishi to see who your local support and distributors are. Not sure where to find the docs on their new website, you may need to make the free account and log into the knowledge base. https://us.mitsubishielectric.com/fa/en Personally been involved in many of these upgrades, even used to teach classes on them to system integrators.

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