General Inquiry: What is available?

[glennlee 0]

Hi All. I have been asked to convert an existing library of PLC code to Mitsubishi. I have zero exposure to any Mistubishi PLCs or touch screens and so I don't know where to turn. I need to find something that is similar to Omron CJ1 or CS1, or comparable to Allen-Bradley SLC. I saw a series called AnSH but the description led me to belive that it is "older" technology. I would also like to get an idea as to what the software and cables cost. I'll keep looking on my own as well while I wait for a reply. Thank you in advance. Glennlee

[panic mode 246]

Personally for anything new I would probably look closer into either FX (for small or medium projects) or Q for medium and large. older CPUs can be cost effective but you need to know that there are few downsides so talk to your distributor - or ask here. For example speed is the obvious factor just like number of instructions (usually not important but it may be in certain cases), some series only support single ladder file (can be frustrating and I don't think you will see this in a spec sheet). Comparable to SLC and CJ1 would probably be the QnAS series. First letter inidicates series, "S" in the name indicates "Small" phisical size but otherwise QnA and QnAS are quite similar (just like AnA and AnAS). the "n" in series name is a placeholder for number (like 1, 2 or 3). Some models also have "H" which means "High performance" (like QnASH or AnSH etc.). AnA and QnA are larger in size (like PLC5 if you want) while AnAS and QnAS are phisically similar to SLC. Q (not the QnA or QnAS) is the flagship and it is most compact (like CJ1M from Omron) QnA CPUs are meant to replace AnA (phisically same size - large) while keeping the racks, I/O etc. similarily QnAS cpus are upgrade path for AnAS (smaller size). cables are (almost) just cables. $200-300 should buy you a set of all Mitsubishi programming cables (no need to worry about spending $2000 on some PCMCIA junk which only works for some CPUs). Software cost will depend on what do you want to program.

[glennlee 0]

Thanks Panic Mode. I too had finally found the appropriate website and spent an enlightening hour browsing. I am not enthusiastic about learning yet another PLC but.... Thanks again. Your response solidified my thinking too. Regards, Glennlee

[Crossbow 295]

At this point, you should look at FX3U for low end, and Q for high end. I wouldn't even consider AnS or QnAS for new applications. Check www.meau.com for all brochures, manuals, and training information.

[glennlee 0]

Thank you. Do you have an idea what the GX software costs? Regards, Glennlee

[Carples 0]

I got GX developer for $1500.00 AUD 18 months ago But.. Gx developer $2280 AUD on RS Or GX develpoer FX for $980.00 AUD on RS. Cables depend on you PLC but $100. AUD to $200 AUD I'd have to say for small apps the ALPHA or FX1 would be the go As to Q Vs FX the Q0J runs a close game to the FX2's and 3's price wise at 16I 16O and the bigger you go the better it looks. If you have to do any serial type comms skip straight to the Q01 or better as they will deal directly in ASCII and save you having to decode the ASCII. I've got a Q and an FX the speed diference is 10 - 1. I got 2 FX3U's on special, if price was the issue for the FX machine the FX would have only just won, but having it on hand was more the issue and the speed is only just enough. but the Q has 2800 odd steps and runs at 5ms scan the FX 280 odd steps for 5ms scan The only advantage I see to the FX3U's is the cheap Serial ports provided you only need one, other than that it seems mitsubishi has closed out its own maket segment. Dont get me wrong Mitsubishi was my first so holds a special place in my heart. Of Mits, A&B, GE, Panasonic, Moeller and Omron, Mits is still my fav The change from Omron and A&B should not be that great, just you will only have 1 ladder and the timers work a bit different. Demo version of GX devloper FX is available too.

[glennlee 0]

Thanks Carples. The price for the software and cables was a bit more than I had thought , but seems to be inline with what I am seeing as a general trend in the automation industry. (I have DEFINATELY got to raise my fees. ...) My Omron and Allen-Bradly software are reaching such stratospheric prices too.Only my Automation-Direct software is still reasonable. After hearing this, I'm going to steer the client away from Mitsu's, or find a way to get them to buy the software for me or include it in the fees. Regards, Glennlee

[Paul Ked 0]

[Crossbow 295]

Steering them away from Mitsu is a really lame solution. I mean, if you are working as an integrator, you need to consider the cost of doing business. Mitsubishi is more powerful, and more cost effective than AB by a long shot. And they use the same software across the board, not 3 differrent packages for 3 different PLCs. And if you do quotes the way I did, I give a total solution price, not a part breakdown price. So it's easy to include software titles in the cost of a project. The full software at about $1300 is about half of RSLogix 5000, and about the same as Omron. If you stick to the FX series, that software's under $500.

[glennlee 0]

Your words were a bit harsh, but true. I do include the cost of the software in my quotes. My main hesitation with adding ANY new brand of PLC is the time it takes to gain mastery of the product-line so that I can propose projects with confidence. Many an hour I have spent troubleshooting a project because I was unaware of some feature of the PLC or its' modules. Every brand I have ever worked with had its "quirks and hard-won mastery. In my line of work, I must design the best solution for the client, and that means working with what I know best. I usually only work with a new PLC brand if the client insists. In that case, I take the time to consult with progeammers and designers with a more intimate knowledge of the product-line. Even then, I alawys find a "gotcha" somewhere . I fear that if I try to master too many platforms, I will be spread myself too thin and deliver marginal projects. Fortunately, I have had enough exposure to a variety of platforms now, that I can usually translate code from my libraries to the new platform. Thank you for the stiff words. They were a refreshing breeze. Glennlee

[Crossbow 295]

I wasn't trying to be harsh. But being that when I came into this industry years ago, I trained at Omron on their equipment, them trained myself on Modicon, Square D, Idec, Mitsubishi, and Siemens S7-200, I know the problems involved with learning a new line. I've worked for vendors and many distributors, and know all too well the challenges of being the entire automation department. But I have found Mitsu to be an easy to use and easy to understand line, even when the software can be a bit confusing. Vendors such as Mitsubishi offer excellent training programs in a variety of locations around the US and Canada. They should be able to help you with that learning curve.

[glennlee 0]

Thanks Crossbow. I was perhaps overly-negative in my assessment of your words. Expanding my expertise IS a requirement for being an integrator. If my client DOES demand I make the change to the Mitsu PLC line, perhaps I can enlist you assistance if I come across any "potholes" Regards, Glennlee

[Crossbow 295]

I'll answer any questions I can.