MrPLC Member
  • Content count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

Everything posted by speakerman

  1. PowerFlex 755 F12 (HW OverCurrent)

    Hey VFD Guy; Two drives are 3 HP PF753, two drives are 7.5 HP PF755, and one is 40 HP PF755. All are firmware 13 or higher. All five run in Flux Vector mode, and all five have encoder feedback. The two 7.5 HP drives are running with torque prove enabled. The fault happens the instant the motor is told to run. It happens while the motor is being fluxed up, before any motion occurs. It happens even when the speed reference is set to 0 Hz. In other news, I tried the programming change to push SVC control into one of the 7.5 HP drives. This worked, no more F12 faults. It did sometimes generate an Output phase loss fault, so we also had to set the Output phase Loss level to 0 or we got that alarm. The output phase loss action was set to 0 - ignore, but it still generated a fault. This is related to the torque prove parameter, as it will ignore the setting if torque prove is enabled. It's still weird, because torque prove was disabled before the testfire happened. No matter, so far we've testfired the motor 10 times in a row with no faults either way, and it appears to be working. I'll post more when I hear back from Rockwell, they are looking into this non-resettable F12 fault. **EDIT: Forgot to mention a comment by Todd from Rockwell, that it could be related to a slip compensation value that is calculated to a ridiculous number during the testfire with an open local disconnect, since there is no motion from the encoder while "running" so the "slip" would be... LARGE? Then once the motor is connected it tries to use that level of slip comp and it results in the F12. Power cycling the drive erases this value and the drive starts with default slip comp values and functions normally again. Just a theory so far, but it seems reasonable, I believe he's attempting to prove that now.**
  2. PowerFlex 755 F12 (HW OverCurrent)

    Hey BobLfoot and ElectronGuru; Thanks for the quick reply. I should back up my original comment and say that Rockwell tech support has now gotten back to me, and there's a fellow trying to help. He had some interesting things to say. His concern is not the encoder feedback but rather the Flux Vector Control mode. He says that changes the way the current loop acts, but is still baffled that we'd get an F12 hardware overcurrent fault with the local open. He is going to get back to me with thoughts on why the F12 comes up, and why it doesn't reset properly. I agree BobLfoot, I have yet to see a reset work. We always have to power cycle the drive to clear it. The manual says it's resettable, and even auto-resettable, so it's a good challenge for Rockwell to make that happen. In the message above I mentioned using a SSV, but I misspoke. It's actually a MSG instruction using a Set Attribute Single command. We been using this method to disable torque proving on two drives that we need to testfire for over a year now, and it works properly. Those are two of the drives that sometimes have an F12 after a testfire, so I'm going to try Todd's advice and build a MSG instruction to switch the VFD Parameter 35 from 3-FVC to 0-V/Hz while local is down, and see if the faults go away. FVC will be disabled after torque prove is, and re-enabled before torque prove is, so it doesn't generate a config error.  Will post the findings after this is tried. Should be able to do it sometime tomorrow.
  3. PowerFlex 755 F12 (HW OverCurrent)

    Hey everyone; We are having these exact same faults with PF750 series drives that are testfired with their local disconnects open. This is the standard required by our local safety authority: when locked out on a local disconnect, full motor control voltage must be sent to the open blades to prove the motor is physically disconnected from the drive. A running status and no motion on the equipment constitutes a successful testfire. I can see how motors with encoders could have a hardware overcurrent fault after this is done, as of course the encoder does not move with the local open. I am assuming the drive must wind up the amps to try and move it. The problem is the HW Overcurrent Fault 12 is supposed to be resettable, but in this case it isn't. The drive will let you reset the fault on the faceplate or through the network over and over, but then immediately fault again as soon as it tries to run. It will fault even if the motor is being told to run zero speed, so it's the action of fluxing up the motor that causes this HW Overcurrent fault, not the load on the motor itself. We also have times where the fault isn't there until we try and run the drive, so we have no idea it's going to fail on the first try. The VFD shows ready to run until it's commanded to, then it faults. The only way we can get rid of this recurring fault is to cycle the power to the drive. After that it runs normally every time. Allen Bradley has not been helpful with this issue, so I'm wondering if anyone else has faced it and solved it. We have many other VFDs that we testfire with the local disconnect open without this fault, and if they don't have an encoder, it works just fine. I am considering trying to do an SSV to change the motor feedback during testfire to open loop, and then change it back afterwards to encoder. Seems a dirty way around what appears to be a firmware problem of the fault not properly resetting. If the fault would actually reset, this wouldn't be an issue. Any leads that someone has on this issue would be welcome, it's a pain.
  4. Hey everyone; Having a problem with RSLogix5000 and a Contrologix L62 Processor. Was adding a MAVE block to a routine and a fatal error occurred as it was being created. I've verified the program offline and everything looks good up to that last live edit, which was the only outstanding change when the fatal error occurred. The last edit is not in the saved file. Now when I try to go online, I get a fatal error every time. I can't find a version of the program that will go online. I can't even upload from the controller and make a new file just to look at it. Aside from the obvious of stopping the controller and uploading a fresh copy of the saved program, does anyone know if there anything I can do to get online and perhaps repair the problem? The processor is running and the plant is running fine. The edit was for some ongoing work that has not been implemented, so it hasn't affected operations. The plant has no scheduled downtime for a couple of weeks, so stopping the controller is not an option right now. I'm hoping for a solution that can be performed in run mode. I've also looked into whether this customer has a Rockwell Support agreement, which at this point is a real thorn, as the tech support will do nothing without it. I've attached the fatal error message the program generated when it went down, in case someone has seen this before. Thank for any help that can be offered. Happy programming, speakerman.
  5. [Demo Software] - Allen-Bradley Logix Family Tag Browser

    Thanks for the trial download. Will give it a look. Price? Happy programming, speakerman.
  6. Hey Leo; I have a manual for that series of PLC, and I know it can be programmed with ProWorx NXT or 32. You do need to know what it was programmed in, and the program printout should identify that somewhere in the header or footer. Otherwise post some pics of the soft copy and it may be apparent. We have a 984-245 here at our plant, and will be phasing it out at some point, but have been able to find refurbished spares and they can also be repaired. It's expensive though. Depending on the application you may have better luck changing the PLC entirely should something fail. You have the program, so that makes it easier. I've uploaded the manual for the PLC familyCompact.pdf in case you need that. Happy programming, Speakerman.
  7. Hey Modiconbob; Thanks for the reply. It's RG-11 trunk, quad shield, but we have since discovered the route has been done improperly to the one drop we're having issues with. The original cable is in conduit on the side of the cable trays, passing above drop 9 on the way to drop 7. There used to be the terminal resistor in drop 7, but when 9 was added they just pulled a tech cable of RG-11 back to 9, laying it in the cable tray with everything from 240VAC to 600 three-phase. It has been this way for a long time without the issue cropping up as far as we know, but over time more and more stuff has been added to that cable tray, so the chance for noise has been slowly increasing over the years. The whole network is about 1200', but most drops are within the first 500. There's a 650' run from drop 5 to drop 7, (They are not in numerical order. It's 1, 8, 2, 3, 10, 4, 6, 5, 7, and 9 in that order. From 8 to 5 is about 400' total. The document with that information has been taken away right now; it's not handy so I can't be exact. We have a plan to add more conduit down to the PLC cabinet, then pull the original trunk cable back to drop 9 and pull a new RG-11 in the remaining conduit to drop 7, making it the end of the line again. This will eliminate the tech cable in the cable tray, and all the coax will be in proper conduit isolated from the rest of the wires. Putting drop 9 in line to drop 7 instead of daisy-chaining back will reduce the length by about 100' overall. Drop 9 has about 4 to 6 retries per second on average. The other drops have between 1 and 2, sometimes none. Very occasionally we'll see three retries in a second on the other drops. The drops closest to the head are the best, obviously, and have the fewest of all. The duration of the dropouts on drop 9 are so far only for one scan of the PLC, and maybe once a day on average, so it is very marginal at this point. We do not have testing equipment for the cable system onsite, and were looking for a contractor from Schneider who could come and assess it. Now that we've discovered this routing issue, we'll address it for sure and see how many retries we have after that is done. Thanks for anything you have to add. This may be a "we post our resolution" kind of path, and that's fine with me. Originally we didn't think we had a cable problem, but now it looks like we do. Will let you know what happens when the cable is re-done. Happy programming, speakerman.
  8. Hello everyone; Long time no chat, been way too busy. Got to cruise the forums for some pay-back after this, it's been a while since I gave back. We've run into a problem beyond my experience, so I have a question for people well versed in the Modicon PLC remote I/O world. We're having some drop-outs with a remote rack of a quantum PLC system, and can find no problems with the cables, taps, or the RIO drop card. We're seeing what seems like a lot of retries, but then we don't know what constitutes a lot. There are 10 drops on this PLC. Drops 1, 9, and 10 are quantum and drops 2-8 are old 800 series. It's a CRP931-00 remote I/O head with a bunch of J890-001 cards, and two CRA-931-00 for the new racks. Funny, but the two quantum racks have the most retries of all the cards. A couple of the 800 series have almost no retries by comparison. The quantum drop 9 has had dropouts at random, sometimes twice or three times a day, sometimes none for a couple days. Causes major problems, obviously. Drop 9 is actually at the end of the trunk cable, so it's got the terminal resistor on one tap. Drop 10 was added later between drops 3 and 4, and has more retries than either of them, but no dropouts. We've asked Schneider for a contractor who can perform a RIO cable network integrity test, but it seems to mostly be these two quantum heads with the most retries, and only the one has been dropping out. Is there anyone who has seen something like this and can comment? We've changed almost everything around it and there's been no change to the retries, and the occasional drop-out still happens. Hope things are going great for everyone out there. Happy programming, speakerman.
  9. Hello everyone; We just installed and commissioned an Ethernet IP network to control 11 small Yaskawa VFD drives with an Allen Bradley 1756 controller. Thought I'd post the results, and offer help to anyone facing this challenge for the first time, as we just did. One short-term burp was not realizing the Yaskawa drives are defaulted to DHCP, which must be changed to 'fixed IP' after the proper addresses are installed. Once we had the proper IPs, the speed set to 100MBPS, and the address mode set to 'fixed', we rebooted the drives and the top green network light on the drive's Ethernet IP cards stopped flashing and the bottom lights started to flash. The top light is network detected, and the bottom is connection established. I proceeded to the Allen Bradley interface and started adding the generic Ethernet modules for each drive. The Yaskawa drives use two 16-bit words each for inputs and outputs in the IP comm, one with the binary interlocks and the other with the speed command in Hertz x 100. The manual I found showed a program example using a generic Ethernet module with a dim of two words for the I/O comm, but of course that had to be changed to 1, as the 1756 uses 32-bit tags. We used the interlock assemblies of 21 for outputs and 71 for inputs, and an RPI of 100ms. Each drive showed up configured immediately. I am very impressed with the ease of this comm setup. We multiply the speed command by 60, as the HMI speed controls were pre-configured in percent, and the drive interprets the command as an integer with two inferred decimal places. (100 percent x 60 = 6000, interpreted as 60.00 Hertz by the drive...). To make this work and put the 32-bit 'Real' speed command in the top two control word bytes, we move it from the real tag to a double integer. Then the double integer is word-swapped to move the speed command to the upper two bytes, and the individual bits of the lower control word are set over the next few rungs. The drives were configured for terminal strip control, and Ethernet IP allows the program to set two control word bits for Ethernet IP network to run the drive instead: bit 5 to take control of run/stop commands, and bit 6 to set the speed reference. I use the control bits to take over the drive when 'remote' is enabled. In local mode we leave the speed reference bit 6 enabled, but the run command comes from the local jog switch. One other burp that arose was the terminal strips for each drive had been wired with a fault that drove an input with the common leg of one of the panel lights. This caused the drives to lock up and not accept the comm speed reference. It was very odd, the drives would run at 33.3 hertz all the time, no matter what the command word was. Once we found the wiring fault and corrected it, the drives started to work perfectly. This was mode more difficult as the small drive's terminal strip is completely obscured by the Ethernet IP option card, and it has to be removed to change anything. Strange that a terminal strip wiring fault would cause the drive to lock up, but I think there is a note in the manual about not begin able to change the reference source during a run command. I think the terminal strip saw a permanent run command, which prevented our reference configuration changes from taking place. Just a theory. If anyone has questions about this, feel free to ask. i know some lead from someone who's gone through the process is always helpful. Happy programming, Speakerman.
  10. Fatal Error when going online

    Hey everyone; Quick note, we completed the installation of the ENBT card in rack one, and the connections from the old card in rack 3 have been moved to it and are working perfectly. Happy programming, speakerman.
  11. Hey everyone; Thanks KidPLC, this is very helpful. It's is a long time after your post, but I am just now looking at a Micrologix 810 and LCD combination, and this is the only post I could find pertaining to that model. I'm trying to find out more on the LCD and what it can do. The on-screen menu lists the ability to modify variables, but the manual states "This feature is not yet implemented…" So does anyone know if and when it will be, or if perhaps it has been by now? The LCD is pretty useless without this functionality, and it is in the menu, so one would think it would eventually "be implemented"… Any Allen Bradley moderators or power users here know the skinny on this one? Thanks, Speakerman.
  12. Fatal Error when going online

    Yes, dmargineau, I forgot to restate that as of now the ethernet IP is done through an ENBT card in a remote rack. The configuration dialogue does ask if we want to schedule their connection over controlnet, and of course it is deselected. It has worked flawlessly so far, as the amount of data is relatively small. Our controlnet itself has always been scheduled, and will continue to be. Once we have the dedicated EIP card hooked up in rack 1, we can add more unscheduled EIP modules to it there. We have four more items to integrate on EIP, and they're on hold until the network to the rack 1 card is complete.
  13. Fatal Error when going online

    Interesting, this was my thought exactly. We do have a scheduled controlnet, just the ethernet IP portion is not scheduled. Most of the analog cards are, but we had to add and change a couple on the run, so we weren't able to schedule them at that time. Everything worked just fine until we could get them into the schedule a few months later. We do plan to move these ethernet connections into rack 1, and then the controlnet issue goes away. I think that may happen faster now it's caused downtime.
  14. Fatal Error when going online

    Hey everyone; So we are up and running after a short delay. Seems the solution provided above did clean the file up and it did upload properly. Unfortunately, it also set all controlnet connections as scheduled by default, so it turned off our ethernet IP network for 9 critical pumps. It selected them as scheduled even though they weren't, and greyed out the selection to turn it back off. Tech support indicated afterwards I should have told them we had an unscheduled controlnet before we started, so word of caution to everyone. We ended up downloading my last best save before the crash, which was the file I had open when the fatal error occurred, and it worked fine, no problems so far. All the ethernet IP modules are back to being unscheduled, and the plant is able to run. In a previous thread, Ken Roach helped me to understand why this system was designed incorrectly from day one, with ethernet cards in every remote rack - and one of them was used for this drive network before we understood the trouble that may cause. I am working on getting it changed, but in the interim it does work fine, and until now has caused no issues. Tech Support said EVERYBODY uses controlnet scheduling, 99% of the time, and our facility is an exception. So, a quick poll - are they right? is it highly unusual to have a contrologix PLC system with the controlnet unscheduled? Ours is pretty small. 14% load, 5ms NUT. My face is ready for some egg... At least we're running. Lessons learned all round. Happy programming, speakerman.
  15. Fatal Error when going online

    Okay, I've talked to Tech Support and they recommended I export the most recent saved file as an L5K version, then re-import it as an ACD file with a new name. That has been done, and I'm waiting for the chance to download this new file to the controller. We will be shutting down the plant for an hour later today, so I'll have my opportunity. Still no word on what caused the fatal errors in the first place, I'll pass on the logs to the Tech Support guys after we get through this problem. Keeping you posted, speakerman.
  16. Fatal Error when going online

    So I have a different question related to this problem: It has been suggested to try a repair of the RSLogix 5000 application, since it is the application that is crashing. I am not sure about this, the application works fine with the other two controllers. If this is done, will it screw up my version? The install is up to V17.1. Will the disk overwrite any updated files during the repair process?
  17. Fatal Error when going online

    Thanks for the suggestion pcmccartney1. Looked in the folder and there were SEM and WRK files present. Moved them out to a temporary folder, went online, got the same error. It made two new files like the ones I removed, and both are at zero K in size. It always crashes when the status display says the program has just begun "Correlating" the offline and online versions. When I try to do a clean upload, it goes for quite a while until it starts to build the routines, and then I get an EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION error. The program is about 6.5 meg, nowhere near the maximum size, and has been edited successfully many times to date. Stumped so far. I'm almost afraid to try a clean upload even if I could get the chance with the plant down, but it seems there's little choice at this point. I've verified I can go online with the two other controllers onsite. The problem is only with this one. I'll let you know what happens.
  18. Fatal Error when going online

    No doubt Michael, I'd be running! So I may be re-installing RSLogix500 then, from the sounds of it.
  19. Omron Ethernet/IP to Allen-Bradley Ethernet/IP

    Hey lostcontrol; It's been a long time, sorry to leave it hanging. We haven't had an opportunity to finish this, the plant has had other priorities. We are so close to trying it, the network infrastructure is almost complete back to the CPU rack. I'll let you know how it turns out. Happy programming, speakerman.
  20. Omron Ethernet/IP to Allen-Bradley Ethernet/IP

    Hey PMCR; Thinking more about it, the Hex dials are a cool idea, as with only two dials you get 255 selections. It does make sense to match the ethernet protocol. Haven't learned about the FINS standard yet, I'll check it out. When we started having issues with the OEM, the management team here considered replacing this Omron system with a remote rack from the Allen Bradley Contrologix PLC that controls the plant. They never wanted Omron originally, but the OEM insisted. I've talked them out of changing it, as it works fine and requires just a bit of software. Would be a shame to waste the whole system - all those perfectly functioning parts. Once I've had some time with CX-One it will be small potatoes to program, and we can reconfigure the EIP network so it basically will be a remote rack for the AB plant PLC - with the added bonus of reducing its processor load. We've almost got the Ethernet cabling sorted out. The conduit pipes between MCCs were full of water and frozen solid so we couldn't pull a new CAT5, but we found some spare fibre to the CPU cabinet. Thought we may be stuck until spring thaw for a bit there. The next post will hopefully be the positive result of getting the system up and running. Happy programming, speakerman.
  21. Omron Ethernet/IP to Allen-Bradley Ethernet/IP

    Hey Everyone; Thanks for the help so far, I was waiting for the final working solution to repost, but that may take some time so here's an update: @james_applied, We will never be able to pay the programmer to help. Unfortunately price isn't the issue here. We had some great help from the Omron reps and were able to get a trial copy of CX-One. I changed all the IP addresses in the Omron PLCs and touch screens to the plant standard, and reconfigured the network between the Omron components so the system is internally happy. Now we have to move the Allen Bradley ENBT card for this interface to the CPU rack - it was put in a remote rack by mistake, and Ethernet I/P doesn't work properly over a Controlnet bridge. Once that is done, I think this will be a straightforward Ethernet I/P connection. First time using the Omron stuff, I found it pretty easy to understand. Everything pretty much worked as explained in the manuals. Weird to have to manually set a hex number on the rotary switches for the node. Bit old-school for a modern PLC, but no big deal. We will buy a copy of CX-One for maintaining this system. So that's where we're at for now. I'll repost when we actually get things talking with any quirks or details discovered. Happy programming, speakerman.
  22. Hey everyone; Trying to set up an Ethernet I/P connection to an Omron PLC here, and everything looks ready, but the ENBT card is in drop 3 of the PLC, not the CPU drop. When I create the new generic ethernet module, it automatically sets it to "scheduled connection over control net" and greys out the selection so I can't turn it off, then gives the error "no scheduled connection over control net". I don't want to mess with the control net configuration, everything works just fine the way it is. We are passing 50 tags one way, as an input-only connection, and there are also 10 VFDs on the Ethernet card already passing 1 tag each, so there's plenty of room on the Ethernet card. Funny, but when I made the generic ethernet modules for the drives it didn't force me to use scheduled connections over control net. It would appear that if we don't want to change the control net configuration we'll have to connect the Omron to a new Ethernet card in drop 1, so there's no data passing over control net. This would mean pulling some more Ethernet cables between the two drops, not a big deal but in winter the cable conduits beneath the ground are usually frozen solid. Does anyone know if that's the case, or if there's another way to do this? The CPU is 1756-L62 revision 17.4 and the card is an ENBT/A revision 4.3, the Onrom is a CJ2M Ethernet PLC, and its comm is set up. Thanks for any input on this topic. Happy programming, speakerman.
  23. Ethernet I/P over ControlNet?

    Thanks Ken; I had a feeling. Allen Bradley is not my strongest PLC type, so I'm still a newbie in many ways. Believe it or not, whoever designed this system configured it with an ENBT card in every one of the control net remote racks. There was only one installed, in rack 3, so we used it for the tiny drive network. I did read a technote saying it was unwise to do a lot through control net, as you will drive up the update times. I considered this when looking at how to install the VFDs, but they are only exchanging a total of 20 words between them, so I wasn't concerned it would pull the system down. The AB KB didn't say anything about not doing it, just about not overloading control net. This new Omron PLC system was set up sending way more words than we need, in a password protected code structure we cannot change, so I was already thinking I didn't want it on control net regardless. As it turns out we have a spare fibre connection to the PLC rack available near our control room touch screen, which has it's own 5-port switch, so I can just patch it to the card from there. We will look long-term towards moving the existing card to the CPU rack. It is a ten-slot, with only the CPU, EN2T, and CNet cards in it. The EN2T is for the HMI connection, so I wouldn't put anything else on that, but we have seven spare slots to play with. We've ordered a new ENBT card and will install it as recommended. Thanks for confirming my suspicions, and I'll avoid ever doing it this way in the future. I didn't know all this when we did the VFDs, or I'd have asked them to move the existing ENBT card to the CPU rack at that time. Good thing it worked! (even though it shouldn't...) Happy programming, speakerman.
  24. Ethernet I/P over ControlNet?

    Sorry dmargineau, yes, there are 6 control net racks. The CPU is in rack 1, and the ENBT card is in rack 3.
  25. S5 Configuration

    Well, it looks as though the idea will be scrapped and we won't be reconfiguring the I/O structure, as we are going to have the opportunity remove the entire S5 PLC at once. I admit to being more comfortable with that, it's a known quantity. It's fun figuring out some of the old legacy products, but we can't afford to risk losing $18,000 per hour to play around. Happy programming, speakerman.