mracer

I have a project that has become a real problem and I would like to ask for your input. The project is a hydraulic pump with a proportional pressure control and proportional position control valve’s. These valves will be controlling a 120” cylinder that need to be able to move at a max of 120”/sec. A ML1500 was used in the spec for control with a string pot being used for position of the cylinder. I have more spec’s for the hole project if someone is interested in working on this. We had two different engineering groups bid on this. The bid was for assembly of the control panel and programming for the control to meet the spec’s given. The bids where both vary close and we went with the one that seemed to have the best handle on what we where asking for. Not the low bid. 17'000 original quote. We are now at a point where the engineering firm has sent us a bill for $13’000 in “extra work” that would seem to be over run, over what was bid. We did not approve this over run (extra work) in any way shape or form, as was clearly stated in the P.O. contract. They have not obtained the level of control that was on the bid and are telling us that an additional $10’000 will also be needed for changes to the control package. I now have the task of ether finding someone to complete this job or paying the first firm the extra and hope that they can complete the job with some sort of satisfaction. How should I approach this? Thanks,

OK, I F-ed up on this one. It needs to move @ 36"/sec. I really don't understand why I am taking so much heat on this one. Now I even have Peter hot over it. I am giving as much information as I can when I can. If I am being a little slow with getting the data out there it's because I am still gathering it for all of you. And some I just do not have. Maybe I shouldn't have asked.

Peter, I respect your input. Thank you. I hope I haven't came across as wining about the cost. If I have I'm sorry. My job now if to figure out what to do with a project that has gone wrong. If that means a differant valve, thats what we will need to do. The problem is I really dont' understand who to trust now. I'm not an engineer. I am just a maintenance guy that is learning PLC's and HMI's. I thought by going to engineering firms I would get was asked for. I'll post what was agreed to. If posting this upsets soemone , well so be it. If it will help others to understand where I am at. I guess I'll take the heat for that when the time cames around. Microsoft_Word___07_20053_EST_068___Wenger___Hydraulic_Controls_Description.pdf

The specs for the hydraulic system where given to each of them before they did any bidding. I was told the ML1500 would have the ability to do the job BY them. I gave them a set of abilities that the system needed to meet. I didn't spec any of the equipment to be used. I did ask the question "can we use the spring pot we are using on the other system we have now as well as the load cell. I was told YES, no problem. The 13'000 over run has been billed to us. We did not have any input on them spending the time before it was spent. In the P.O. to them is states that any work/time over the original P.O. needed written approval from both sides. I agree that if they had came to us midway and told us they where having a problem with the string pot or ML1500 we could have worked those things out and known about the extra charge to do so. I had an hydraulic engineering firm work on the pump and they had there work done before the electrical side was done. That way everyone was on the same page. If the electrical would have had a problem with the pump side we would have changed that before anything was started. Everything was in written form before the work started. I really don't think its on the hydraulic side of things. I could be wrong. I am posting those specs. It was the Hydraulic outfit that recommended the electrical engineering firm to us. We have not used them before. the Electrical company that is. I made every attempt to make sure everything was agreed upon before anything started, with both of them. No P.O.'s where issued until everyone was happy. The hydraulic side knew what the speed needed to be and how we wanted to control it. The electric side knew what the hydraulic side was going to use and what would be expected of there controls. Or at the least I thought so. I would post the specs that where agreed to, but I have no way to remove the name of the firm in question and I don't think it would be right to do so with out removing there name. I would e-mail to someone if needed. Thanks everyone for your input it helps. Large_Pump___cylinder_J11718H_Model.pdf

Bob, I have not worked with the 40 but I am guessing it would be like the 4's. I have a PF4 and a ML1100 talking and it works well. There is information in the knowledge base about getting them to talk with a message command. Not much help I guess but I would think its about the same. Marv.

{Mracer takes note so while attending class with Ron he will not be "little Johny"},lo Good stuff Ron, thanks l

Yep, I found it. Too many Hrs and not much sleep. Ow well, just need to look harder before I post a question. Thanks for the help.

Is there a way to turn off the screen saver in a PV+ 600/1000? I have one that our R&D dept would like to watch with there web cam. It runs some tests over night/over the weekend and they can watch it on a web cam. If the screen saver turns on they can not see the cycle counter. Any ideas? Thanks I think I found it.....dow...

I have a project that I would like to do a FIFO with string data. It’s a part number that would look something like this. 123A45B78. When I looked at the instruction set I see that a ST file is no included in the FIFO list. Is there some way of doing this with a ML1100 or a SLC 505? I would like to set up a way of tracking a part through our paint line. Thanks Marv

Could it be a power supply problem? Maybe a shorted input or an output, pulling the supply down to a point that shuts it down?

I have problems with a ML1200 and ENI. I was told the ENI has a problem getting "over worked by the network. I haven't tried it yet but I was told to set the speed to 9600 on the ENI and ML1200 to slow things down a bit. This may or may not help you out.

I'm not sure I am following. So the first bar code would go to ST10:0, the next would go in ST10:1 and so on? I'm getting lost on how the counter will be used. Right now I am taking the string data (ST10:0) and moving it depending on the size. If len=>6 or <10, it is a part number and gets moved to ST10:2. If the Len is >2 and <4 it is the part count and gets moved to ST10:3 The Plant Metric's picks this data up from there. If Len=5, it's an employee ID # I also need to "0" out ST10:0 after the move so the bar code gun and send the next data. That has all worked vary well. Now I'm ready to take it to the next level. With the Part number, I can tell if the washer pump PSI needs to be turned down(some parts gets blown off with high PSI) also the cure oven temp changes with some parts. I have also been asked if I can make this data available to the Planers so that they may see where there parts are (JIT-Just in Time) for Assy Line planing. I am using the RTA Ethernet interface, 435 i think is the PN, and it's worked well for me. Thanks for the input. I know I can get this working. I just need someone to point me in the right direction.

I am vary green when it comes to the gathering of data from a PLC. I have Plaint Metrics now but it is so much over my head that I need to get someone in every time I need to add something new. The other problem I have is the FT Metrics is so much of an over kill for what we are trying to log. All of the OEE stuff is just fluff to me. All I need is how many times did the machine cycle and what part number was it making at the time. (corrugation die cutter, short runs) One thing I do need is, I need to be able to have the data available to several people, Plaint Manager, Unit Manager and Planers.

Now is the time to change too. AB has a "Step Forward" program that will get you a rebate on the SLC 505. I am doing a 505 and changing from a PV 900 to a PV+1000 and used the program to cut the cost of doing it. Hope this helps. racer

OK, Here is what I have working to this point. It is doing a good job of counting and changing direction, but I still have a problem with the repeatability. The counter will count sometimes 1 or 2 counts after the stop. I think there should be a way to move the ACC. count from "forward" to the /Pre for "Reverse". At this point I just See "trees" lol Is there an easier way? Point me in the right direction. Thanks Racer RD_Motion_RSS.zip.zip

I have a project, that I have been working with, that I think may work better with a high speed counter and the programmable limit switch instructions. The project is a motor controlled by a powerflex 4, a 40:1 gear box with a sick photo eye looking at shaft rotation. I have a disk with 26 flag's on the output shaft that the eye is watching. It will need to wind the output shaft up a number of counts, slow down, creep to a number of counts and stop. Then the drive will rev. and repeat the process, unwinding and stopping in the same manner. My program is set up the slow the drive speed down in 2 steps, ( high speed 60, slow down-15, creep-5) I have it working but I keep loosing counts when the speed gets to the upper end of the operating range. I have a SCP that changes the counter Pre based on the drive's high speed set point. One thing that could be going on is the shaft keeps moving after the motor has been told to stop. I have the Decel set vary low that seemed to help a little. I have read the Instruction description for the HSC and PLS but I still don't quite understand if this will work for my application. Can some one share a little incite on these? Racer

Ken, I still have it just setting in the office/workspace for now. I did play with the filter settings but it didn't seem to change anything. I did the math before talking to Sick about I ordered the eye and got the same cycle counts for the input. It will have vary little load on it when it is running. It will be used in our R&D area to do some cycle testing on our products. I have a short video of it running that I tried to post but couldn't get it to work. Then this laptop crashed in the middle of doing the post. I should have checked to see if the first one had posted. Sorry for the double up. I really think it has something to do with the counters and there presets.

I use a 2 pc lock collar with a bolt screwed in to it and a prox to watch the head of the bolt. The 2 pc collar can be put on with out taking it apart to get it on. Racer

How about a bar code for each size? I have a simple bar code reader that I use to tell a ML1100 what is going on at a machine. Things like PM, waiting for material, meetings, indirect work, work orders for R&D and break down/maintenance. I also send the part number that is being worked on. Some simple code using the string could trigger a counter. Maybe that counter could be seen at the HMI or sent to a Excel file. Just a thought. Racer

This brings up a question that I have. What is a good switch to be using? I have looked at the B&B switch's. Are there others? Racer

http://freetranslation.imtranslator.net/?dir=en/zh&text= This is one that have used, Although not for Chinese. Hope this helps.

Thanks Ken, That jogged my memory to the point I remembered what I had not done. I needed to set up my laptop with an IP and not get it from the network. Marv.

I am setting up a PowerFlex 4, a ML1100 and a PV+400 for a small project. I have the ML1100 Ch1 set up to use the Ethernet port. Ch0 will be Modbus to the Powerflex using a 1763-NC01 I have a Ethernet switch I will be using for the PV+400 and the ML1100. I I have other ML1100's on out network at work and they are working well. I have set the port setting to IP 10.100.8.62, sub 255.255.255.0 and gateway set to 0.0.0.0. If I plug the laptop into the switch I can't see the Ml1100 with RSLinks Classic. I have tried a cross over cable to thinking maybe that is what I needed. What am I missing?? Also is there somewhere I can find information the Modbus Data address's for the Powerflex? I have looked in the users manual for the drive but can't seem to find where these address's are listed. I have the sample program that is on AB's Knowledge Base that shows some of them but I will need more for this project. Thanks as always for the help. Marv.

I think I have what I am looking for on the drive. Yes, I set up the Ethernet driver just like I did for all the other ones. Thats what has me stumped. If I have the laptop connected right to the ML1100, using a null/cross connected cable, I should be able to see it right?

Yes You should be able to control with a Pico. It has relay outputs so you will need to supply the 5 volt. A Pico make a great timer. Racer