brucechase

I'll try my hand at this. PLC law 41 - In a system where a plc and a windows computer (PC) exchange data, the plc usually isn't the one that stops the data exchange. I know there are exceptions to all laws - that's why I get a ticket and my wife gets a warning - but in my environment, when this data exchange stops working, it is usually because a service on the PC has stopped, not becuase the plc decided it didn't want the data that it had been getting for years. This also usually follows some kind of "update" in the windows machine. The last time this happened, coming up after a shutdown, there was no comms between the plc and the computer. The IT guys swore (up, down, and sideways) that they did NOT touch the computer. After 8 hours of trying to figure out what was wrong, it seems an IT did backup the computer and plugged the ethernet cable into the wrong NIC.

I would like to know how everyone else change (or would change) programs on multiple machines at the same time (or even sequentially). For instance, say you have 40 machines that are all identical and running the same program. The machines are all connected via DH+ (4 different networks with 10 on each network) to a contrologix gateway so you can access these via ethernet. If you want to update all the programs with an identical change (like add a new rung), how would you go about doing this so you don't have to spend a tremendous amount of time clicking? Ha anyone seen a Rockwell product that can do this? Is there any other method that anyone can think of. (I did post this on another plc site but received no answers so I thought I would try here. Sorry to all who have seen this question before.)

With more than 150 of these and a data highway that is not all that great (no I can't change to ethernet processors), it would take about 10 minutes to go online, go to edit mode, make the change(s), accept, test,and assemble edits, then save the program. Multiply that times 150 (or closer to 200) and you are talking about 30 man hours to make a change. That is about 1 week to make changes. If there were several of these in a month, then there is no time to do anything else. Currently I have 2 separate machines that run RSLogix and a Macro program and they divide out the changes between them. Still takes more than a day but it is all automatic and I can do other things while it runs. I was just wondering what someone else (who has a lto more experience than me) would do.

Do you know if RSLogix 500 has this built in and if so, which version would I need? All the machines are running on SLC 5/04 (and there are a lot more than 40 - there is actually more than 150 of these). A simple change can take days. I don't know anything about a VBA interface, but I'm willing to learn, just give me a shove in the right direction.

The FLL works for me. Never had a problem, but still have to do one string at a time.

Jeff, I was in the same boat as you about 10 years ago . I had only seen 2 plcs and actually changed only 1 line of code. Now I'm the "expert" here. I really didn't find much in books, most of what I learned was troubleshooting and deciferring other's code. To try to help explain what you want, I also had a huge problem with writing code from scratch. That was only because I've never done it before. What I think you are looking for (and what I really needed) were all the little "tricks" and "standard code" that makes a plc so unique. How do you initialize all the things you are controlling. Most anyone can program motors to start and stop but what should be included in every program with a motor is a section of code that says if you tell the motor to start and you don't get a run contact in 2 seconds, then alarm. There are all kinds of stuff like this that should be in a program to make it easier to work with - and I think that is what you are asking for. I spent a lot of time looking for information on "how" to program but I never really found what I was looking for. As you write more, you will have certain sections that remain the same for many different programs (alarms, HMI, faults, etc). This is really the meat of programming, not getting the machine to do exactly what you want, but what to do when it doesn't. I hope this helps.

gravitar, Let me know where I can get some of them parts. I have some 33MHZ machines that can not use larger than 500MB hard drives. It's the Unix operating systems that limits this. I have resorted to buying flash HD (at $500 each) because I can't find anything that small anymore. I recently purchased 15 old drives from a computer salvage co. and I could not get even 1 to run reliably. Machine downtime is a killer (we need a smiley for pulling out our hair). I know I'm way off topic but I just really want to post something since I haven't in a while.

Here's another brute force method. This should tell you over 1 billion served Just noticed that my program is for a slc 5/04 not a 1200! The one shots are different (aren't they????)

Terry, there is one thing to consider when doing this style of program and that is who will be responsible for troubleshooting and/or program modification. In the plant I work at, the techs can and do get into the program to troubleshoot and sometimes modify (I cringe every morning that they do that). Most will be able to understand your way of programming but here there are few that would feel comfortable with the fifo and even less with panic modes method. I'm not saying that these are bad, quite the contrary. I think that the bitwise handling is very good and I've even used the fifo a few times. I like it and wouldn't have thought of that way of handling I/O (that's why I come here is to learn some of this higher level stuff). If you don't have good people that can understand this and you don't want to get called in at 2:00am to tell them why the solenoid won't come on, then sometimes the less elegant way of programming might be better.

I use Printkey2000, just like snagit but it is freeware. http://www.webtree.ca/newlife/printkey_info.htm

I use both the Brady IDXpert and a Dymo. Most wire labels are done on the IDxpert. Most box labels on the Dymo, but I use the outdoor vinyl on the IDXpert also.

With all this talk, I want to know if anyone has put a VFD on the HVAC. I have toyed with that idea alot but never went so far as get one and try it. I would probably get an AD or other inexpensive one. This would eliminate the lights dimming when the motor starts and could supply a more even heating and cooling system by reducing the "shock' of the hard blowing of cold or hot air.

OK if we are going to talk about keyboards in the tire industry, I've used the following. Please note that some of the operators took this as a challenge. I went through about 4 of these before they proved their point. The cost is pretty reasonable though. Virtually Indestructible Keyboard As for panelviews, all ours have the conformal coating. I'm in the final area so there isn't as much tire gunk as curing, but we still get it.

Are you saying that you have 3 phase heaters? Since most heaters are a resistive device, they are usually connected line to neutral or between 2 phases. Is the 3600 watt rating for 220 V? Is your 220 Volts a phase to phase voltage or the phase to neutral voltage (assuming that you have a Y system and not a delta system). If you are using phase voltage, you will have a slightly unbalanced system since you have 10 of these. If you could give a little more information, I might be able to help.

Here is a way I did it to track part counts across different days. I used a FFL and FFU and also just a basic move instruction to accomplish the same thing. I didn't trust the FFL and FFU and I had to have a count displayed right away. This also gave me a verification that it worked. I just copied the section out of my original program. I hope it is understandable. UNTITLED.RSS

Yes, Accusort did buy the Allen Bradley line of the Adaptascan BCR. They still support these even though I have not had a lot of luck with Accusort tech support in general. I have recently set up the Adaptascan SN8 on a devicenet network. Since this was my first forray into Devicenet, the learning curve was steep. I do currently have 8 of them working using the Devicenet M registers. By the way, the Adaptascan is NOT the same as the model 22. Many different functions. I am curious on how you wrote the barcode in directly in the N register. Was that using devicenet or a serial input? I didn't think there was any way to write from a devicenet device directly into the N register of a SLC. Again, I'm such a novice on devicenet it's pathetic. It's on my list to get better at along with Mitsubishi PLC, Contrologix, Panelview+, VB, ethernet comms, SQL, Modbus, RIO comms, and a few others.

I just read through the program that alik posted and I'm curious if there is some standard "rules" that some people following when programming. I noticed that in every ladder, he looks for a math overflow and then sets a bit then unlatches it. I really don't see anything that would cause a math overflow anywhere in the program (no math functions) so I assume that this is some standard way this programmer writes his/her code and just puts it in every project. Do others do the same? I have rarely used the unlatch for the math overflow but I try to never use that since that means there is some MAJOR error in the way I wrote some code. Any ideas???? Maybe we could start a post that people list there "default" program styles to share information? Don't know if there is any interest in this or not. Just some observations. BGC

There are no contracts here or any company I've worked for. I am a degreed EE currently working for a tire manufacturer in South Carolina. Typical work week is 45-50 hours. On call 24 hrs/day. If called in on a machine emergency, will get OT at straight time. On shutdowns (where work is 16-20 hrs/day for 4 days) we will get paid at straight time (hourly techs at 3X = $90/hr - which is also 3X my pay). Must be at plant 1 weekend every 3 months - no pay. Even though I make it sound bad, it really isn't a bad deal (amazing how we lower our expectations the older we get). This is a much better deal than my last job (company took away all salaried vacation and layed off 10 out of 12 engineers - I was lucky that time). Was never paid anything extra and was ale to leave the plant 4 hours early on Christmas Eve. First job at Gov't facility. Work wasn't hard at all. Payed at ST for all hours over 40. Never worked weekends and raises were always 5-7%. Left there because I was bored and never challenged.

It has been running in sveral slc5/05 for years on my system. If you want to post the file, several of us can look at it and maybe see something that you missed.

I'm with trn_psycho on this. Assuming what you say is true (the programs are exactly the same), the next logical place to look is in the field wiring. I did have something very similar to this happen to me during a machine modification. The program was the same before and after but one relay would chatter whenver the output came on. It was a loose jumper pin in the terminal block. Took 2 days to find it since it wasn't in the wiring at all. If you are using a wiring arm, verify that there is no insulation under the terminal screw. Good luck and let us know what (if anything) you find. BGC

My setup is identical to Luke's (so much so it's scary). I have a gateway on which I attach 14 processors via several different DH+ nodes. I installed several access points in the plant ceiling and my Dell laptop has built in wireless. Since they are on the network, I can look at them via my wireless laptop, or from my desktop, or (with a secureid key) I can see them all from my house via the internet. We also collect a tremendous amount of data on 4-5 PCs via ODE topics. In addition, I also use the PC to write to plcs for synchronizing time and to load recipes and status bits. As you can also see, I am now installing 5/05 directly on the ethernet network and bypassing the gateway completely.

So are you saying that it is a firmware rev that is causing this problem? Since I only have a couple that I have a problem with, I am willing to try this. I just need to get the latest one from my AB guy and stick it in. Do you know when the series C came out? Is this a new thing? Also, how did you find out that this was the problem? Thanks Bruce

I have a problem that AB has not been able to help me with. I have 2 SLC 5/04 on a DH+ going to a contrologix gateway. If I connect to only 1 of the SLCs, do an online edit, when I assemble the edits, the process comm faults and it drops off the DH. I have tried 4 different processors and the SVC command to no avail. This problem also exists on a different channel on the same gateway. The curious thing is 1 SLC nevers gives a problem, the other faults 3 out of 4 times. My polling rate from a server to the gateway is the same for all SLCs. On the gateway, I have a total of 7 channels and this problem is only on 2 of the channels. I have swapped cards and that did not help. I can go on serially without any problem. Any help or comments would be greatly appreciated. BGC

I just moved a contrologix gateway and I see that there is a fault when I go on RSLinx. Everything is working fine and all communications are good. I am using RSLinx Pro (not gateway) and I get the following screen. By the way, this is the system that faults out every time that I do an online edit from the data highway. Any thoughts on how to clear or view this fault.

Thanks for still remembering this topic, I've tried that (in my first post I talked about the SVC command) but that did not help. Also I set the bit as described and it didn't help. This problem is still happening and on frequent occasions. I want to add another panelview on the system and wanted to go DH+ but it looks like I might have to go RIO just to prevent other problems. I'm at a lost and at times (like all day yesterday) very frustrated over what I think should be a simple system.