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Firetubes

CPM2A and C200HX-CPU44 on Ethernet

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I'm not an expert with Omron but we have a CPMA and C200HX-CPU44 that we want to collect some data off of with our PC running Wonderware Intouch. My question is that is it possible to put these processor on Ethernet via an adapter or gateway device or will I have to run serial cable from them to the PC? Optionally, I was also thinking of upgrading them to CS1G-CPU45H so that they are similiar to our other CPU's but not sure if the program will need to be rewritten? Thanks for any input.

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Those models do not support Ethernet. You could upgrade them both to versions that do, the CPM1/2A could be replaced with a CPL/M/H, that has a Ethernet module available, and the C200HX would need to have the backplane & CPU upgraded, to allow for an ethernet module to be added to the rack, providing there is a spare slot? One of the good things with the Omron platform, is a conversion from an earlier model is very easily done. IMO that would be a pricey way to go just to get some data from them. You could get an ethernet to serial gateway, I cannot think of any reason why these would not work, and would be a fraction of the cost & time involved in upgrading. Bearing in mind however, that standardising is also a good idea....

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Thanks for the suggestions, Scott. Do you know what serial protocol is use by the CPM2A and C200HX-CPU44? I guess my next step is to find a DDE or OPC IO server. Update: Ok so I did a little poking around and there's plenty of OPC servers for the C200HX from well know companies but not for the CPM2A. Any recommendations? I would like a server that can handle both rather than buying separate packages. I read up on the Omron CX-Server OPC and believe this will work with both PLC's? Edited by Firetubes

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Whilst I think about it, are any of your CS1 PLC's connected to the InTouch system? If so, then what protocol are they using?

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Scott, We are using Intouch 10.0 and WW Omron FINS Ethernet DAServer 1.5 to connect to a couple CS1G-CPU45H. WW also has the Omron FINS Serial DAServer 1.5 but it wont work with the CPMA so I was looking for 3rd party drivers. The OMRONHL8 sounds like an older style driver from WW? Is the Omron's Hostlink Protocol sold by Kepware. I didn't find any support for the CPMA on that one if it is. Also I've found some info on a serial to Ethernet converter (Omron Digi One IA) but reading further it's a modbus to modbus/TCP converter so I am a little confuse if it will work for the CPMA and C200HX. The first link says it does and the 2nd says it's modbus. I'm guessing the serial protocol for CPMA and C200HX is modbus? http://www.digi.com/support/kbase/kbaseresultdetl.jsp?id=489 http://www.digi.com/products/serialservers...ia.jsp#overview

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One good solution is to use Red Lion DSPLE as gateway. It has at least 2 serial ports and an Ethernet port. Configuration software is free. Check at there website SVN

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Check out Ewon gateway M2M 4002. Seems like it is fit for your application: http://ewon.be/Pres4002.htm I have seen a demo at our office and it looked pretty straight forward to setup using web interface. Never got a chance to work with it though. MPT_eWON_Omron_UK_V50.pdf

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you may config your system like this (Not tested) C200HX --comm1---------OPC | --Comm2---------CPM2A (One-to-one PC Link) page 226 of manual Cat. No. W353-E1-05 CPM1/CPM1A/CPM2A/CPM2C/SRM1(-V2)

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The info I have for the HL8 server says C-Series PLC's, it is my understanding that this will work with the CPMA range. I don't have a CPMA to test with unfortunately, I do have a CP1 which may work... I will also have a look at the DASOMSerial.. The EWon info that pdl posted does look like an option also, but then would you need 2 of them...? I am pretty sure that MOXA do a 2 port serial server over ethernet http://2g.moxa.com/product/NPort_5210.htm This may even be easier, but then it has to run the application on the Host PC. I would be looking at the HL8 to begin with, but would want to go to the DAS longer term. The easiest way for this would be to upgrade the CPMA to a CP1, how much is involved in that?

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Unless the PLC models are not within approx 60ft you can use the model I suggested, it has 2 serial ports. On the other hand it has a lot of overhead for something that is primarily a serial to ethernet gateway. The advance would be it natively supports Host Link and FINS.

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Thanks for all the hardware suggestions. I will definitely check them out. If anyone is interested in the Digi, it's actually the IAP, not the IA model that works with Omron. For the software portion, Kepware says their Host Link OPC driver will support the CPMA under the "Open" option but I'll try the ww free driver Scott suggested. If I was to upgrade the CPMA, what is the most cost effective Omrom model with Ethernet? I don't need more than 10 discrete IO's and if I can get a few analog inputs, that will be a plus.

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I would go for a CP1L CPU with the newly released CP1W-CIF41 Ethernet option board. You can fit a CP1W-CIF41 in a CP1L-L14 CPU and up (not L10). L14 or L20 will do for your discretes, and you can add a CP1W-AD041 which gives you 4 freely configurable voltage/current inputs. See here for a CPU line up with I/O capacity listing: http://www.ia.omron.com/product/family/1916/index_l_u.html CIF41 is also listed under Options.

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Thanks for the info, PdL! I was also looking at some of the programming terminals like the NT31 and NV series but they don't appear to support Ethernet. Is this correct?

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The step in HMI model with Ethernet currently available is the NS5, the equivalent and follow up model of NT31. See here for a model listing (not all models support Ethernet). http://www.ia.omron.com/product/family/155/index_l_u.html In Europe they will release a low cost HMI model with Ethernet beginning next year (NQ series), but for the US I don't know.

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Ok, thanks. Now going back to the CP1L CPU, does it have a built in serial port or is this something I need to order extra along with the Ethernet port?

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It has a built uin USB port for programming. If you need a RS232 port you can plug in an option board CP1W-CIF01.

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That's great! I was reading the Ethernet spec a little more and was a little concern if I will be able to connect 2 NS12 terminals as well as the Wonderware Intouch. The specs says only 2 simutaneous connections? I'm looking to pull probably 100 - 150 tags from the PLC for each touchscreen and around 30 tags for the Wonderware. FINS Communications Service Specifications Number of nodes 254 Message length 1016 bytes max. Size of buffer 8k Communications Function FINS Communications Service (UDP/IP, TCP/IP) FINS/UDP method Protocol used UDP/IP Port number 9600 (default) Can be changed. Protection No FINS/TCP method Protocol used TCP/IP Number of connections Up to 2 simultaneous connections and only one connection can be set to client Port number 9600 (default) Can be changed. Protection Yes (Specification of client IP addresses when unit is used as a server)

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Ok, lets back up again, what is the IO count you are looking for if you are going to upgrade to a CP1x model? You could possible go to the M model, which has the facility to have 2x option boards, I would make 1 an ethernet, and the other a serial, and put the 2x NS's on 1:NT link. This way, you can have the WW using the ethernet, and also a spare connection for programming. It is my understanding that these ethernet modules are very limited in their functionality. PMCR will be able to give you the exact limitations I am sure... I do have 1 installed, but have not had a chance to do some more rigorous testing with it. I currently use it for SCADA and PLC, with no apparent issues anyway. I cannot recall if you said what your requirements for upgrading the CPMA were?

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There are 2 different Ethernet adapters available for CP series PLCs. 1 is the Omron Japan developed CP1W-CIF41, the other is the Omron US developed CP1W-ETN01-US. They have slightly different specs, but are very similar in concept. Either device is essentially an Ethernet to serial converter, so both will have some limitations compared to an Ethernet module directly on the PLC CPU bus like the CS and CJ Ethernet modules. The CP1W-CIF41 uses the Toolbus protocol on the PLC side, and has a frame length limit of ~ 1000 bytes. The CP1W-ETN01-US uses the CV Mode Host Link protocol on the PLC side, and has a frame length limit of ~ 500 bytes. The recommended connection of no more than 2 devices to an Ethernet adapter is due to limited buffers and the throughput of the device. 2 Devices work very well, but more than that and things can get tricky. There is a setting in NS Designer to directly support the CIF41 (limiting the frame length of the NS Ethernet frames). If you choose to replace the CPM2A with a CP series, and want to put everything on Ethernet, I would suggest the following: Use a CP1L or CP1H PLC with 2 plug in adapter slots. Use 1 CP1W-CIF41 to communicate with your NS touchscreens. Use 1 CP1W-ETN01-US to communicate with Wonderware and CX Programmer. I know this sounds strange, but it is a good configuration. The CIF41 design only allows 1 per PLC. The CIF01-US does not have this limitation, and will happily co-exist with a CIF41. I took a look at the eWON adapter that PDL suggested. I did not see if this supports C Mode Host Link (which is the command set used by the CPM2A and C200H alpha family) or only CV Mode Host Link (CV, CJ1, CJ2, CS1, CP1H, CP1L). If you can find a good driver for Wonderware that supports Omron C Series PLCs, using this with the Omron Digi serial to Ethernet adapter is a good choice. This would be lower cost and faster to implement. If you will be using the machinery for many years to come, it could make sense to upgrade the CPM2A to a CP1L or CP1H, along with a CS1 upgrade for the C200H alpha.

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Thanks for the explanation, PMCR. Glad to know there's 2 different cards because the web only listed the CP1W-CIF41.

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Here is a link to the US developed version. http://www.omron247.com/doc/pdfcatal.nsf/5...t%20ver.1.0.pdf

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PMCR, do you think I can add a third NS touchscreen the CP1W-ETN01-US so basically 2 NS on the CP1W-CIF41 and 1 NS plus the WW on the CP1W-ETN01-US. The problem is the PLC is in a remote location and we need to control the equipement at multiple locations. Maybe best to go with a bigger PLC platform?

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I can test this configuration for you if you would like, but at that point, I would recommend using a CJ1M-CPU11-ETN (CJ1 with a built in Ethernet connection). Most likely if you want 3 connections now, you will want 5 in 2 years.

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Thanks for the offer but I was able to talk them out of it and to stick with your original hardware suggestion thank goodness. Going back to the CSIG-CPU45H, can I add the Ethernet card on the second rack since the first one is full? If not, since the 1st rack is an 8 slot rack, I can upgrade to a 10 slot without too much trouble but will there be any programming issues I should expect? Edited by Firetubes

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Firetubes Either choice (change backplane from 8 to 10 or add a second rack) would be extremely straight forward. You can mount a CS1W-ETN21 ethernet module on the second backplane with no issues. Changing the backplane from 8 to 10 slots adds no complication at all to a C200H to CS1 migration.

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