replacement for AB Panelviews

[moltra 0]

I am looking for a good quality low cost replacement for allen-bradley Panelviews. Any ideas? Mark

[Leadcommander 0]

ProFace have a good range. must ask, why do you wont to replace the Allen Bradley Panelviews with another brand?

[moltra 0]

To save company money!!!!!

[Ken Moore 23]

What communication protocol will you be using? Most vendors support DF-1, but DH+ and ethernet/IP are less common.

[comeng 0]

"Looking for low cost high quality HMI" aren't we all Not sure this nirvana exists but willing to reconsider have used AB. Mitsubishi(Beijer) and Proface all work OK, remember you have to factor in cost of software and time for the learning curve.

[BITS N BYTES 66]

If you are looking for great performance at low cost take a look at Maple Systems. I used a small unit on a recent project where cost was critical. Very pleased with the result and suprised at the numerous built-in features. Software takes a bit of getting used to if you have been using Rockwell Software, but its a heck of a lot cheaper. http://www.maple-systems.com/ [And NO I do not work for or represent them]

[TimWilborne 108]

Funny you should mention them. I'm currently evaluation them also. I have a customer that wants to use them with some Micrologix 1100s. Good to know you were pleased with them. Thanks TW

[moltra 0]

Yesterday, I had to replace a PV550 with DF1 comms with a PV600 with DH485 due to "somehow" the screen being shatter. Right now I have 3 of my PVs on DH485 and one on Ethernet/IP. I am looking at replacing alot of the manual buttons on my machines with PLC and displays for controls for data collection purposes. But it is not cost effective to install a $1500 display to replace 6-10 buttons. I am also looking at acouple of small selfcontained Display/PLC to run these machines. I will look at the maple-system products.

[TimWilborne 108]

I think the Cmore units from Automation Direct will do Ethernet/IP

[BITS N BYTES 66]

You didn't mention in your original post that you also need a self contained Disply/PLC. Maple does not make such a product. Have used the Horner APG OCS [Operator Control Station] on some projects with great success. C-Scape software is FREE and combines both the PLC Logic AND the HMI objects within a single program - REALLY SLICK FEATURE!! The PLC scan time is lightening fast as is their C-Scan network [i had 15 units networked on the C-Scan network sharing I/O - never missed a beat]. The only possible downside for your application is that you already have an installed base of Rockwell stuff. I am not sure whether the Horner OCS units can communicate with Rockwell. LOOK'S LIKE IT'S THE PERFECT TIME TO CHANGE YOUR CONTROL PLATFORM!!!!!! http://www.heapg.com/Pages/Products/products_OCS.html

[comeng 0]

I would not go this route ever in an industrial environment, push buttons are robust and cheap, I have noticed that any sort of touch screen does not survive being operated by knife blades, screw drivers, stacker truck forks and gorillas (sorry highly skilled operators) Also if the stop button is on the screen and the screen freezes or disappears oops. Maybe in a control room with technicians but not out on the shop floor

[Chris Elston 78]

I like this point too. I NEVER EVER, design, write software that is dependant on the HMI screen. I ALWAYS, provide: 1. e-stop 2. power on button 3. cycle start 4. cycle stop 5. reset 6. manual / auto selector. The reason for this is just as above, if someone smashes your HMI, you can't start the machine without a laptop and a few force bits. If the HMI dies on your machine, you should still be able to start and stop the machine but just now know what the heck is going on. I like designing like that and it's gotten me a few "attaboys" later on down the years.

[TimWilborne 108]

Thanks for the advice and samples. This is good info. Anyone else got any suggestions? I'm going to send this thread to my customer.

[moltra 0]

WOW this thread exploded. Alot of good information in this thread. I do use manual buttons for start/stop the buttons that would be replace control things like height, tension, pressure, and speed of the machines. I want these on a PLC so that in the future I can add recipes and pull data like how many feet produced.

[Automation_Tech 0]

http://www.redlion.net/g3features/ I like them

[swimmy67 9]

I have been trying to find a better Touch Screen also, but I can not seem to get away from IDEC Touch Screens. They added Ethernet/IP to their 10.4" and 12.1" Screens. Here is a link. http://www.idec.com/usen/products/Catalogs...Interfaces.html The programing software is about $130.00 one time fee with free updates. These screens work with most PLC's on the market. Swimmy

[paulengr 44]

Also glove covered hands with sand/grit that even with kind, conscientious operators, tends to abrade the crap out of the screen. I've been in many plants where touch screens did very well. But in the plant I'm in now, touch screen just means routine replacement program. If you only need a touch screen or you need 8 or fewer buttons, there are a LOT of choices. If you can get by with just 3 buttons, the built-in Micrologix 1100 screen works fine. If you have an environment where touch screens won't survive and you need lots of buttons for whatever reason, then you are stuck with AB's PV+ line at the upper end (the larger screens). I have an application right now that needs about 24 buttons because I'm dealing with gorillas both in what's between the ears and in terms of how the equipment is treated. The Panelviews survive reasonably long (2-10 years). Hard wired push buttons are REASONABLY cheap. But if you factor in the $150-$200 per IO point on AB distributed IO (our "machines" tend to be spread out over hundreds of feet with hundreds of sensors and actuators), the push button simply isn't so cheap anymore. I had an operator panel with a panel PC ($6500+ for a NEMA 4 panel PC and keyboard with air conditioner) and a push button station with 48 total buttons, totalling about $20K by time you put it all together. Even with AB's outrageous $4K pricing for 10" panelviews, it made the cost very attractive.

[TimWilborne 108]

Look for anti-glares. Many HMIs have them, I know AB does. Works good for abrasives in a steel mill. You have to replace them on a routine basis but better than the screen itself

[robh 12]

Does anybody still use the AB RediPanel? I think that they quit making these. I would like to have a lighted push button panel that is an ethernet I/P device, this would be a real nice addition to a PanelView.

[Nathan 7]

How powerful a panelview are you looking at replacing? A simple, small unit or a basically fully functional HMI (ie Panelview Plus 1000-1500 range series)?

[moltra 0]

PV550 and PV600 plus

[nnixon6 1]

I've worked with most "name brand" operator interfaces and the Maple Systems Silver series is by far the worst. The software (EZWare-5000) is unintuative and does not provide good error checking and something as simple as formating a lable to the center of a pushbutton takes an enourmous amount of screwing around. Oh, and don't call their technical support - in the name of holy God, don't call their technical support! You *WILL* end up far worse off after applying their "solution". ProFace, CTC, these are all good alternatives - just NO MAPLE SYSTEMS pretty PLEASE!

[phillm47 0]

We have used allot of Maples Silver Series Enhanced panels. I would agree that that the the EZ-Ware 500 & Silver Series are unintutative, but they're inexpensive and get the job done. On the other hand I've had good experiences with the new Maples Silver Series Plus and EZ-Ware 5000 series software. Still inexpensive, and I''ve used mutliple HMI's connected to a PLC with Ethernet IP. The PLC had a 1761-NET-ENI. I've also had decent experiences with their tech support. Not flamming you, and no connections with Maple Systems, just sharing my experiences. edit: spelling Edited 26 Apr 2008 by phillm47

[BobLfoot 301]

I just "stumbled" onto this post. SInce I've worked for both End-Users and Systems Integrators in a variety of fields I'll add my two cents. -- Whenever the cost of your pushbutton panel exceeds 50% of an HMI it will be cheaper long term to go with the HMI. -- Chako I agree with your idea of Start, Stop, Auto Manual, ... being physical buttons, but several manufacturing processes require tweaks to setpoints and these are not easily brought from anywhere else but the HMI. How do you handle these. -- Count me as an AB, Onron and Proface user who found all these to work just fine.

[Clay B. 1]

I have replaced several AB touchscreens with the C-more units and yes C-more will do ethernet very well. In my opinion the software is very easy to use. Also the C-more's seem to support all the major PLC's.