lamboom

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  1. I would like to verify that connectivity will not be an issue with a non-Omron EtherCAT drive ... especially in the area of streaming position data.   Does anyone here know how to do that? Specifically .. the compatibility between Omron's NJ101-1000, ver. 1.0,  and the LinMot, EtherCAT Cia402 drive: C1250-DS-XC      A lot of people think it will work, or "should work" ... But the failure of the NJ to stream position data via E/IP to a LinMot Ethernet/IP drive designed to receive streaming over E/IP (Rockwell' Allen Bradley PLC can do it)  ... has caused some concern .... I would like to be sure that these devices are compatible.    Thanks much....
  2. Omron NJ and EtherCAT LinMot Drive

    PS:   In other words ... "high performance" is not really required...  but some level of performance would be nice...
  3. Omron NJ and EtherCAT LinMot Drive

    Hi  MotionControl.CAT ... Thanks much for your info..  I have quite a love for LinMot drives, and when I discovered the NJ, I just had to find out if they would work well together. It looks like the E/IP port is useful for simple tag based applications using the LinMot linear motor.  The only reason I wanted to use the E/IP port for streaming position data... is because it was there, and I had an E/IP drive. (which is designed for streaming via E/IP)  You aren't the first to try and pound some sense into my desire to answer that initial NJ/LinMot/EIP streaming question.  But, In my defense, Rockwell (Allen Bradley) has managed to do it using some clever Function Block and the drive's EDS file.. (it's beyond my limited ability to grasp .. sadly, I'm quite green when it comes to this technology) I am aware of Tsunagi Labs .. and, it was suggested that I apply for an opinion from them.   However, I felt this E/IP thing didn't merit that level of attention by Omron.  I will continue to investigate the NJ's EtherCAT compatibility with the LinMot "DS402" drive  (C1250-DS-XC ..their model no.)     My use requirements are very reasonable, and not demanding in accuracy ... I'm just trying to make waves in a demonstration tank for science and educational purposes.  However, the waves are mathematically designed to model the real ocean. Your  input is much appreciated.
  4. Wow! .. where to start.  You are a wealth of info.   I tried to fill out a "form" from the Tsunagi Lab.  It was an Excel document that my MAC had a hard time with. (it does have Microsoft Office)      TsunagiProblem_CheckList_07172015.xlsx TsunagiRequestSheet_FY16.xlsx After thinking a bit about this, I may be asking too much by requesting help on this subject.   The obvious solution is to use the EtherCAT LinMot drive, Not the Ethernet/IP Drive.   I think going to Omron with such a request for solution to a very uncommon problem, is not justified.    In fact, LinMot was not happy that I was trying to do this; although, their tech support did try to help me (this thread contains some helpful references from them) At this point.. like you said: Yet... you, Tyler and a few on this forum seem to be an exception.   Sometimes, just the fact that it's different.... is an interest in itself.  It also helps if the solution doesn't take hours of research..        I've been reading up on what I can find in Omron's literature.  Also the "theories" that have come in from you, Tyler and Michael W.   All, have given me the inspiration to "explore" the possibilities.   I should design a simple Sysmac project, using only the NJ101-1000, the HMI and the LinMot E/IP drive .. nothing else.   In fact... I might remove the HMI,  and use E/IP I/O's if that would mean less clutter to the E/IP network. Use simulated streaming position data.. just the same small position incremented each cycle .. so the linear motor just moves out at a constant velocity, no velocity or acceleration (Position only) using virtual servo, ... cyclic tasks, that send the incremented position as a tag to the LinMot drive. I would appreciate suggestions on how to structure that program (Not the program itself..   I can see that much of the "structure" is in Inno's first reply above.  Might need some clues on the Task programming... but, I have some good references from Tyler .. enough to go for it.
  5. Meanwhile: Tyler Corbett (an Omron Support Specialist)  commented: "If you link a EIP tag to a task in the NJ than we may be able to refresh every 5ms(fixed interval). A task in the NJ always executes at a fixed period and if it executes the task by the end of the period then you get a watchdog error. You would either have to off load code or extend the period. **The biggest issue looks like, would be the AB is using a custom function block to talk to the LinMot drive which has access to all of the parameters and actually can control/command the drive. We either need the Omron to LinMot custom block (if there is one) or find out the low level code inside that function block and how it works to create code to emulate what it is doing. It is sort of like Omron has this set up called eplc which makes a Ethernet IP connection from a NJ to an adept robot and to program the robot there are function blocks. Inside the function block is internal code that links the variables we make to the robot. We don't see behind the scenes of how it actually links to the adept robot via the normal function blocks. Also, If you lock a tag to a task then it may also be bogged down by system services (explained in page 56-64 of the tasks programming PDF attached) which are other pieces of data that get sent via EIP." It may be possible that the Tsunagi Lab, in Japan might help with a solution.  Tyler says they are a group in US and Japan, that tests third party connections with other vendors. I'll post any progress... to be continued.     
  6. Inno...   I didn't notice that you used "Virtual Servo" for the axis type in your example program.  When I added the equipment (R88D drive and G5 motor) I changed the axis type to "Servo". And that's the way it is today .. which is working fine for the present configuration: Random Sea to the G5 motor.      Are you suggesting, I go back to Virtual Servo .. remove the G5 drive and motor from the equipment..  and have only the LinMot E/IP drive in the System. ? I'll study Motion Control manual (W507-E1-14) a little harder, and see how one would use these Virtual Axis types in a program.....
  7. Hello Inno - Glad you had the time to comment.   That's great  that you figured out Rockwell was using virtual servo and virtual encoder to stream to LinMot.. I couldn't have done that. Even setting up something similar in NJ, there's still the issue of sending packets at precise intervals over E/IP with NJ...     I reached out to Omron support a while back, and an Omron engineer living in Canada contacted me, Tyler Corbett.  He too is interested in solving this question, and will be talking with a friend of his about Rockwell's technique for doing this streaming communication with LinMot over E/IP, later this week.  We are using email, however if anything useful is discovered, I'll post it to the Forum.     So far. there doesn't seem to be any interest in connecting LinMot to Omron .... yet.      Perhaps machine builders out there don't appreciate the awesomeness of LinMot .. works under water, only one moving part (the slider rod), almost never wears out (billions of cycles) incredibly powerful (force up to 275 Kg) and super fast or slow ... and, very accurate. This post has had 173 views to date.. and you are the only one to comment on it .. thanks so much...  
  8. Update   .. the LAST WORD on this question will be delivered in about a week for those that can't wait .. Methinks the answer is NO... the NJ cannot stream position data to the LinMot Ethernet/IP drive over it's E/IP port... there,   said it .. the E/IP port is  not for motion control ... DUH!    unless ya want to do something real simple.. like pick an place...
  9. Hi... It's beginning to look like the the answer to the question "Can the NJ stream position data to a E/IP LinMot Drive" .. is NO    The NJ, using Ethernet/IP, can not produce Tag based data in constant cycles (which LinMot requires for streaming)  ...  CIP messaging doesn't look possible either.   However, over EtherCAT, the cyclic position data is constant, at 1ms, 2,ms or 4ms (with my NJ101-1000)  all within the range for LinMot streaming ... so they say... So now, I'm looking at using the EtherCAT port and the LinMot Drive C1250-DS .. an EtherCAT drive.. LinMot claims the drive will act as an Axis slave, just like Omron's G5 series motors. Which really work well when streamed with position data... Has anyone ever used a EtherCAT LinMot drive with the NJ successfully?     Thanks much, Regards, Michael
  10. I'm going to try an' write a simple test streaming program where the position data describes a simple straight line, where every 4ms a new position point is sent which is only incremented , evenly, by a very small change.   According to LinMot the command must arrive at the same increment of time.     What if a position is calculated during the first CPU cycle, but isn't sent until the start of the second CPU cycle?  .... and so on ...    Is that even possible?    if so, at least the periods of the sent data would be identical... and, at 4ms.  within the range for LinMot streaming.
  11. Yes, Inno ... Communication with the LinMot is working well with simple tag commands for position "go to" commands, Jog, Home etc.. all had to be satisfied via Sysmac and Network Configurator  ("NC" is the most difficult and frustrating program I have ever encountered, by the way    I have not been able to send the "first" streaming command to the drive, as shown in the ST above in reply #3 .. which is quite disappointing .. I should be able to start the stream .. then see it fail  ... with a Fault. on the drive... as it does when streaming is simulated using LinMot's TALK 6 software.  In fact, it is impossible to simulate streaming from that software; but, as I said above, it is possible to START the stream, using the Command Header 784  ... A test position stream can be ramped from zero, and take a while to get somewhere.. so, there is no problem with too large a position increment .. which would cause following errors.    The Error that pops up in the "simulated" stream using software.. is buffer overflow because there is only one point sent at the start.. and no 2nd point can be sent.
  12. LinMot position streaming via E/IP

    Hi again..  Yes LinMot manuals can be quite vague in the instructions and "example" category .. But, they are getting better.. the walkthru manual they sent, and I just posted, is a good example of that.  They finally started a suite of YouTube tutorials about a year ago.. and hopefully will add more. As for the best reasons for using LinMot ... for me, that was a no-brainer.  The LinMot Linear motors last forever, Billions an' Billions of cycles, they are "very" powerful, have only one moving part, can get splashed with water, are "very" fast (like a rail gun) or extremely slow... and are space efficient ... and, if required, are very-very accurate ... they are also a bit expensive  
  13.  Latest News:  LinMot support just sent a preliminary walk-through file on E/IP streaming to LinMot E/IP drive using a Rockwell CPU: Microsoft Word - Rockwell_PVA Streaming_Walkthrough_Pictures.docx.pdf Here it is in .docx: Rockwell_PVA Streaming_Walkthrough_Pictures.docx Now to find someone that knows Rockwell and Omron NJ...
  14. LinMot position streaming via E/IP

      LinMot support just sent a preliminary walk-through file on E/IP streaming to LinMot E/IP drive using a Rockwell CPU: Microsoft Word - Rockwell_PVA Streaming_Walkthrough_Pictures.docx.pdf Here it is in .docx: Rockwell_PVA Streaming_Walkthrough_Pictures.docx Now to find someone that knows Rockwell and Omron NJ...
  15. LinMot position streaming via E/IP

    Had to read your post ... thanks... will get back.. meantime check out http://forums.mrplc.com/index.php?/topic/32436-nj-streaming-position-data-to-lin